Worse Loss

[Pakuni]

nm

[Pakuni]

The last Elite 8 team scored 47 points in a loss to UWGB.  That same year, they beat SE Louisiana 63-54 in the 2nd game of the year at home.  SE Louisiana finished 285th in KenPom.  There was another 9-point home win against NC Central. 

Shaka's first year here, probably what this team is closer to at the beginning of the season, had 11 and 5 point wins against SIUE and New Hampshire to open the season.  They began the Big East losing 3 straight as part of a 4 game losing streak.

Those teams all got better as the season went along.  One of them was supposed to be pretty good, the other we didn't know.  People should relax and have a cream soda.

This isn't a terribly persuasive argument.
Sure, some teams start slow and improve.
Some teams also start slow and stay that way.
And some teams start well and regress.
I have no idea which we'll see from this team, and I'm not particularly concerned about it. I have no expectations of this year's team other than they not completely stink.


I just think it's silly to shout down, mock and shame people who visit a basketball discussion forum to discuss what they see from a basketball team. It's not like what's being said isn't true. Gold and Jop are bricking too many open shots. Lowery and Norman are struggling. The offense goes stagnant for long stretches. What that means for the rest of the season ... who knows? But don't try to make people feeling bad for discussing the obvious.

[rocky_warrior]

Gold and Jop are bricking too many open shots. Lowery and Norman are struggling. The offense goes stagnant for long stretches. What that means for the rest of the season ... who knows?

Obvious panicking

[Uncle Rico]

This isn't a terribly persuasive argument.
Sure, some teams start slow and improve.
Some teams also start slow and stay that way.
And some teams start well and regress.
I have no idea which we'll see from this team, and I'm not particularly concerned about it. I have no expectations of this year's team other than they not completely stink.


I just think it's silly to shout down, mock and shame people who visit a basketball discussion forum to discuss what they see from a basketball team. It's not like what's being said isn't true. Gold and Jop are bricking too many open shots. Lowery and Norman are struggling. The offense goes stagnant for long stretches. What that means for the rest of the season ... who knows? But don't try to make people feeling bad for discussing the obvious.

I prefer being Mr. Dodds of Scoop.  Please subscribe to my newsletter

[Viper]

82 posted an interesting stat in the NBA thread on the Superbar.

These are the professionals making millions of dollars, and they're still wildly inconsistent.  Now compare that to a three game sample size for collegiate athletes who are expected to be even less consistent. There will be games where we shoot bad from three, there will be games where we shoot good from three, such is the way of life for any basketball team.

'collegiate athletes'? They gettin' paid too, right?

[Viper]

Rico, I'm going to state my piece, and expect that you'll ignore it or give some snarky response. So it goes.

I have you on my Ignore list due to your incessant trolling and pot-stirring. You and the three other people I ignore filled my feed with s**t and I'm glad to not have to wade through your banter.

For better or (mostly) worse, some folks still quote you and others, meaning I must or can read what I'm try to ignore. Very infrequently, I see that you have posted something of value, providing insight rather than inanity. Such as the above post. Thank you for that contribution.

Oh well, I'll not hope for greater discretion on your part with most of your future posts.

mug644, I hear ya, but here's the deal. Rico is a troubled lad. The dog ate his ice cream cone. The petting zoo visit turned tragic. You get the picture. Sooo...cut him some slack. It's a charitable write off.

[Uncle Rico]

mug644, I hear ya, but here's the deal. Rico is a troubled lad. The dog ate his ice cream cone. The petting zoo visit turned tragic. You get the picture. Sooo...cut him some slack. It's a charitable write off.

Shouldn't you be worried about your brother-in-law?  Game is just about on us.  Hope your nerves are under control.

[Its DJOver]

'collegiate athletes'? They gettin' paid too, right?

What does them getting paid have to do with them being collegiate athletes?

[Viper]

What does them getting paid have to do with them being collegiate athletes?

these aren't collegiate athletes. They are pro's.

[Viper]

Shouldn't you be worried about your brother-in-law?  Game is just about on us.  Hope your nerves are under control.

worried? ...my guy won the WH. I'm good.

[Its DJOver]

these aren't collegiate athletes. They are pro's.

They are by definition, collegiate athletes.

Regardless of the title you bestow on them, the underlying point is that you would not expect them to be as good as NBA players. The stats show that even NBA players are wildly inconsistent, so it would be logical to expect collegiate athletes to be even more inconsistent.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

these aren't collegiate athletes. They are pro's.

They're both.

[Newsdreams]

What does them getting paid have to do with them being collegiate athletes?

He hates them for making $

[Newsdreams]

This isn't a terribly persuasive argument.
Sure, some teams start slow and improve.
Some teams also start slow and stay that way.
And some teams start well and regress.
I have no idea which we'll see from this team, and I'm not particularly concerned about it. I have no expectations of this year's team other than they not completely stink.


I just think it's silly to shout down, mock and shame people who visit a basketball discussion forum to discuss what they see from a basketball team. It's not like what's being said isn't true. Gold and Jop are bricking too many open shots. Lowery and Norman are struggling. The offense goes stagnant for long stretches. What that means for the rest of the season ... who knows? But don't try to make people feeling bad for discussing the obvious.

Offense hasn't been implemented 100%

[Uncle Rico]

He hates them for making $

No one likes the free market unless it is exploiting people for the sake of entertainment.

[Newsdreams]

mug644, I hear ya, but here's the deal. Rico is a troubled lad. The dog ate his ice cream cone. The petting zoo visit turned tragic. You get the picture. Sooo...cut him some slack. It's a charitable write off.

I don't know WTF happens at MU School of Dentistry, graduates end up sort of looney and lost.

[Pakuni]

Offense hasn't been implemented 100%

So, if I understand some of the comments here:

1. Shaka is going to run the same offense no matter what, so we better get used to it.
2. The offense - the same one that's been run for 3+ years - hasn't been fully implemented.

[wadesworld]

So, if I understand some of the comments here:

1. Shaka is going to run the same offense no matter what, so we better get used to it.
2. The offense - the same one that's been run for 3+ years - hasn't been fully implemented.

The offense is going to have the same principles.  Shots at the rim and from behind the arc.  Pick and roll/pop.  Get out in transition.

[Uncle Rico]

The offense is going to have the same principles.  Shots at the rim and from behind the arc.  Pick and roll/pop.  Get out in transition.

Correct.  Paint Touches article is probably an eye into the future

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

I think Newsie is kidding - that was Buzz's excuse for why they almost lost v. Norfolk State back in the day. They hadn't installed their zone offense yet.

[Pakuni]

The offense is going to have the same principles.  Shots at the rim and from behind the arc.  Pick and roll/pop.  Get out in transition.

Yes, I agree with this.
I'm not buying the idea that a team whose rotation is filled almost entirely with players who've been in the system 2+ years is still implementing the offense, after six full weeks of practice and three games.

[Hidden User]

For how much we have lauded Shaka in years past for his in game adjustments, maybe we can also believe that there will be game by game experiments and adjustments too and not use a sample size vs mid major opponents in figuring out what is effective in a new look offense.

Not everything clicks at once or works the first time. There is also something to be said for not rolling out the same thing over and over all season long from an opposition scouting standpoint too. (Cough Wojo)

[4everwarriors]

Rico, I'm going to state my piece, and expect that you'll ignore it or give some snarky response. So it goes.

I have you on my Ignore list due to your incessant trolling and pot-stirring. You and the three other people I ignore filled my feed with s**t and I'm glad to not have to wade through your banter.

For better or (mostly) worse, some folks still quote you and others, meaning I must or can read what I'm try to ignore. Very infrequently, I see that you have posted something of value, providing insight rather than inanity. Such as the above post. Thank you for that contribution.

Oh well, I'll not hope for greater discretion on your part with most of your future posts.

Good luck with that, hey?

[Pakuni]

For how much we have lauded Shaka in years past for his in game adjustments, maybe we can also believe that there will be game by game experiments and adjustments too and not use a sample size vs mid major opponents in figuring out what is effective in a new look offense.

Not everything clicks at once or works the first time. There is also something to be said for not rolling out the same thing over and over all season long from an opposition scouting standpoint too. (Cough Wojo)

To me, the issue right now is less about the system - the system is creating plenty of open looks - but the ability of some players to execute it. Shaka obviously has a lot of faith that Gold can knock down open threes. So far this year (and I'd argue for his entire MU career) Gold hasn't done much to justify that. Maybe he's just in a slump and he'll be a 38% shooter before we know it. But if not, it's going to be a big drag on the offense.

[BM1090]

To me, the issue right now is less about the system - the system is creating plenty of open looks - but the ability of some players to execute it. Shaka obviously has a lot of faith that Gold can knock down open threes. So far this year (and I'd argue for his entire MU career) Gold hasn't done much to justify that. Maybe he's just in a slump and he'll be a 38% shooter before we know it. But if not, it's going to be a big drag on the offense.

You don't think 34.1% over 177 attempts over two his first two years justifies that he can/will knock down open shots? That's a better percentage than Chase his first two years on more attempts, and I think most of us are good with Chase shooting the open shots and trust he'll knock them down at a decent enough clip.