Vaccine Misinformation

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Well, well, look what we have here:

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna71027

Maybe read more?

Still, experts stress that vaccination is the preferable route to immunity, given the risks of Covid, particularly in unvaccinated people.

"The problem of saying 'I'm gonna get infected to get immunity' is you might be one of those people that end up in the hospital or die," Murray said. "Why would you take the risk when you can get immunity through vaccination quite safely?"

[statnik]

Maybe read more?

Still, experts stress that vaccination is the preferable route to immunity, given the risks of Covid, particularly in unvaccinated people.

"The problem of saying 'I'm gonna get infected to get immunity' is you might be one of those people that end up in the hospital or die," Murray said. "Why would you take the risk when you can get immunity through vaccination quite safely?"

I'm talking about people who already know they had it when it was mandated for work, school or other places.  Those people should've been considered in similar stead to those with one round of vaccines.

[statnik]

Europe accounted for natural infection for many of their mandates, the US largely did not.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Yeah. Maybe they should have just accepted the science and got the shot. Not much sympathy here.

[TSmith34, Inc.]

Idaho lawmakers introduce legislation to criminalize those who administer COVID vaccines
The bill would make administering an mRNA vaccine -- a COVID vaccine -- a misdemeanor.
https://www.ktvb.com/article/news/local/capitol-watch/idaho-lawmakers-introduce-legislation-to-criminalize-those-who-administer-covid-vaccines-legislature/277-2436a514-e7da-4b31-9762-f9be10300075

Ahhh, no wonder Idaho is Chico's Promised Land. You know, it would be helpful if all you anti-vaxxers would move to Idaho en masse, sure would make the post-mortem clean up easier.

[statnik]

Idaho lawmakers introduce legislation to criminalize those who administer COVID vaccines
The bill would make administering an mRNA vaccine -- a COVID vaccine -- a misdemeanor.
https://www.ktvb.com/article/news/local/capitol-watch/idaho-lawmakers-introduce-legislation-to-criminalize-those-who-administer-covid-vaccines-legislature/277-2436a514-e7da-4b31-9762-f9be10300075

Ahhh, no wonder Idaho is Chico's Promised Land. You know, it would be helpful if all you anti-vaxxers would move to Idaho en masse, sure would make the post-mortem clean up easier.

As usual the truth is somewhere in between but neither side can handle nuance.  The vaccine has been beneficial for some, made no difference for many, and has hurt a small (but understandably frustrated) minority.  It shouldn't have been mandated but shouldn't be criminalized to administer it.

[jesmu84]

As usual the truth is somewhere in between but neither side can handle nuance.  The vaccine has been beneficial for some, made no difference for many, and has hurt a small (but understandably frustrated) minority.  It shouldn't have been mandated but shouldn't be criminalized to administer it.

Isn't this the same outcome as any other vaccine?

[reinko]

As usual the truth is somewhere in between but neither side can handle nuance.  The vaccine has been beneficial for some, made no difference for many, and has hurt a small (but understandably frustrated) minority.  It shouldn't have been mandated but shouldn't be criminalized to administer it.

Can you name one American who was forced to get the vaccine?

[Coleman]

Can you name one American who was forced to get the vaccine?

I am pro-vaccine but enlisted members of the US Military were forced. But they are also forced to get about a dozen other vaccines. It kind of comes with the job.

But you're right, no one else was really forced. Some companies mandated it. But isn't letting companies do what they want a conservative principle?

[reinko]

I am pro-vaccine but enlisted members of the US Military were forced. But they are also forced to get about a dozen other vaccines. It kind of comes with the job.

But you're right, no one else was really forced. Some companies mandated it. But isn't letting companies do what they want a conservative principle?

Even active duty could resist and be discharged.

[statnik]

Isn't this the same outcome as any other vaccine?

For vaccines to be required for primary schools, higher education, etc. they're typically something that's a serious concern for their particular age group.  COVID-19 does not fit that for a lot of the institutions that require them so in my mind (and a large pct of the country) it's one of the reasons there shouldn't be COVID-19 vaccine mandates for schools/most workplaces.

[statnik]

Can you name one American who was forced to get the vaccine?

Not in the literal forced, but Fordham University requires bivalent boosters, and this announcement came partway through the semester and did not offer tuition reimbursement for those who thought 'enough is enough'.  That's quite close to 'forcing' someone to get the vaccine:

https://www.fordham.edu/student-life/safety-health-and-wellness/health-services/covid-19-vaccine-requirement/

[jesmu84]

For vaccines to be required for primary schools, higher education, etc. they're typically something that's a serious concern for their particular age group.  COVID-19 does not fit that for a lot of the institutions that require them so in my mind (and a large pct of the country) it's one of the reasons there shouldn't be COVID-19 vaccine mandates for schools/most workplaces.

So you believe vaccines can and should be mandated for any one in a particular age group that is susceptible to the illness?

[statnik]

So you believe vaccines can and should be mandated for any one in a particular age group that is susceptible to the illness?

It's plausible, I can see where assisted living homes might want a mandate.  I don't prefer it, but most of all I'm opposed to it happening where most of the people mandated aren't at a big risk of severe disease and death.  What's the worst about university mandates for the vaccines is they were often for the student body but not the faculty, looked like they cared about protecting the older faculty from students carrying it but not the students themselves.

[reinko]

Not in the literal forced, but Fordham University requires bivalent boosters, and this announcement came partway through the semester and did not offer tuition reimbursement for those who thought 'enough is enough'.  That's quite close to 'forcing' someone to get the vaccine:

https://www.fordham.edu/student-life/safety-health-and-wellness/health-services/covid-19-vaccine-requirement/

Students can choose from 3000 other colleges

[statnik]

Students can choose from 3000 other colleges

This happened partway through the semester that they mandated the bivalent booster.  Either you lose tens of thousands for nothing or you take a booster, neither are good options if you're vaccine/repeated booster hesitant.

[reinko]

This happened partway through the semester that they mandated the bivalent booster.  Either you lose tens of thousands for nothing or you take a booster, neither are good options if you're vaccine/repeated booster hesitant.

🎻 🎻 🎻

[jesmu84]

It's plausible, I can see where assisted living homes might want a mandate.  I don't prefer it, but most of all I'm opposed to it happening where most of the people mandated aren't at a big risk of severe disease and death.  What's the worst about university mandates for the vaccines is they were often for the student body but not the faculty, looked like they cared about protecting the older faculty from students carrying it but not the students themselves.

So you do support mandates and vaccines. Interesting.

[statnik]

So you do support mandates and vaccines. Interesting.

Reading comprehension ftl.  I'm not going to rail against some mandates the way I would for less vulnerable groups.  I know nuance isn't popular here.  Mandates should be a last resort if the situation is dire and it's completely obvious the people involved would consistently and nearly completely benefit from the protection, that isn't the case at schools and most workplaces.

[jesmu84]

Reading comprehension ftl.  I'm not going to rail against some mandates the way I would for less vulnerable groups.  I know nuance isn't popular here.  Mandates should be a last resort if the situation is dire and it's completely obvious the people involved would consistently and nearly completely benefit from the protection, that isn't the case at schools and most workplaces.

Did you just state schools shouldn't require vaccines for students?

[forgetful]

Did you just state schools shouldn't require vaccines for students?

I'll wait for him to rail against Universities that mandate a bacterial meningitis vaccine for the students, but not the faculty.

[statnik]

Did you just state schools shouldn't require vaccines for students?

Use your critical thinking, I said schools shouldn't require vaccines where the risk is relatively low like COVID-19, and of course in this case they rushed the production so its effects were less known at the time of mandate compared to most of the required vaccinations.  Many of these required vaccines are due to the high prevalence and virulence in children, certainly a contrast to COVID where they are least at risk of any age group.

[jesmu84]

Use your critical thinking, I said schools shouldn't require vaccines where the risk is relatively low like COVID-19, and of course in this case they rushed the production so its effects were less known at the time of mandate compared to most of the required vaccinations.  Many of these required vaccines are due to the high prevalence and virulence in children, certainly a contrast to COVID where they are least at risk of any age group.

So you do support mandates and vaccines?

So confusing

[statnik]

I'll wait for him to rail against Universities that mandate a bacterial meningitis vaccine for the students, but not the faculty.

The risk is greater for college students than most other demographics, in an environment where it spreads as well.  Also it has had much more time to be studied for side effects.

If I was really anti-vax I wouldn't have received the AIDS vaccine on campus that was required based on my service learning site back in college.  I am definitely anti-mandate for this particular vaccine though, in nearly all cases.

[statnik]

So you do support mandates and vaccines?

So confusing

The risk of long term side effects has to be demonstrably low in addition to a significant threat to the population they are requiring it for in order for me to support vaccine mandates.