More conference realignment talk

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

It's too bad that Cal and Stanford jumped ship when they did, because this (see below) would easily be a top 6 hoops conference and roughly comparable to the ACC in football, with at least some semblance of geographical unity:

Cal
Stanford
Washington St
Oregon St
Boise St
Colorado St
Fresno St
SDSU
SMU
Tulane

Pat Forde alludes to Cal and Stanford knowing this was a possibility but wanting no part of it.  They're making more in the ACC and its a better institutional fit.

[Nukem2]

They could go after Utah St. and North Dakota St. and rename the league “PAC St.”.

[MUeng]

Yeah, they didn't merge because you now don't have to share with Utah State and Hawaii.

And that Wolken article is terrible. What else were OSU and WSU supposed to do?

I thought the article was pretty good actually. Sure osu and wsu are now irrelevant and have battered egos since being left without a chair, but it drives home the point that all major realignment has been done to caress egos.  I agree osu and wsu basically had to do this, but they probably also think they deserve a shot at playoff glory in this new conference when in reality they don't.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

I thought the article was pretty good actually. Sure osu and wsu are now irrelevant and have battered egos since being left without a chair, but it drives home the point that all major realignment has been done to caress egos.  I agree osu and wsu basically had to do this, but they probably also think they deserve a shot at playoff glory in this new conference when in reality they don't.

But the bolded isn't true. Almost every decision to leave conferences or jump to another is about generating more revenue in the short or long term - which Wolken calls a "Ponzi Scheme." (Which it definitely isn't by the way. Does he even know what a Ponzi Scheme is?)  OSU and WSU know what they are doing here. It is doubtful that they are just making guesses about what their next contract would look like - they very likely had pretty solid estimates when making presentations to the four schools leaving. The fact that Wolken thinks this is about vibes, feels and egos just means he doesn't have access to the information that the schools certainly have.

But let's also look at another quote from this article:

"Why did Southern Cal engineer a jailbreak from the Pac-12 for the Big Ten? Because their program had been in stasis and there was a perception among USC administrators that the Pac-12 wasn’t doing enough to help them get back to national relevance."

Well, he's right about that. The Pac-12 was poorly managed for a long time. Turned down a media deal that they should have taken. Yet USC and UCLA stuck with the Pac 12 until it was obvious that the B10 was going to be significantly more lucrative for them. So they left. Same story with Texas and Oklahoma and the SEC.

This is about money. And you can't blame schools for making more money considering the resource challenges that many will have moving foward.

[brewcity77]

They could go after Utah St. and North Dakota St. and rename the league “PAC St.”.

I endorse this suggestion 

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

I saw a couple things today saying that it is unlikely that any FCS schools would make the jump to join the Mountain West since FCS to FBS now requires a school to pay the NCAA $5 million.

So unless a school wants to take that leap, the MWC might be limited to the likes of UTEP and New Mexico State.  Which is...not great.

[dgies9156]

The ticking I'm hearing these days is the bomb planted underneath the foundation of the Atlantic Coast Conference.

When that thing goes off, it won't be pretty. They'll be blood everywhere as Clemson, North Carolina, Virginia, Notre Dame, Florida State and Miami head elsewhere. It's going to happen, sooner or later.

Stanford and Cal went from the Conference of Champions to the Conference of Also-Rans.

The ACC is a backwater weakling in football. It's premier programs, Clemson, Miami and Florida State generally suck. Most of the rest of the conference thinks a football is a warped or worn-out basketball.

Your move, losers!

[Viper]

The ticking I'm hearing these days is the bomb planted underneath the foundation of the Atlantic Coast Conference.

When that thing goes off, it won't be pretty. They'll be blood everywhere as Clemson, North Carolina, Virginia, Notre Dame, Florida State and Miami head elsewhere. It's going to happen, sooner or later.

Stanford and Cal went from the Conference of Champions to the Conference of Also-Rans.

The ACC is a backwater weakling in football. It's premier programs, Clemson, Miami and Florida State generally suck. Most of the rest of the conference thinks a football is a warped or worn-out basketball.

Your move, losers!

100%, brother Dgies. Cal and Stanford needed to stand pat for another year, SMU too, imo. They’ll probably end up in another year or two where they should have gone anyway.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

100%, brother Dgies. Cal and Stanford needed to stand pat for another year, SMU too, imo. They’ll probably end up in another year or two where they should have gone anyway.

They’re making significantly more money in the ACC than they would have been had they stayed in the PAC 12.

[Plaque Lives Matter!]

Is St. Thomas too far east for the PAC-12

[WeAreMarquette96]

The other 3 make sense but Fresno St being added over other options confuses me. Candidate pool to get to 8-10-12 teams imo assuming they don’t add Midwest/East coast teams: Gonzaga (bball only), St Mary’s (bball only), UNLV, Utah State, Wyoming, Nevada, New Mexico, New Mexico St, Idaho, Idaho St, Montana, Montana St, North Dakota St, South Dakota St, San Jose St, Sacramento St, UC Davis, Texas State, UTSA, UTEP, Memphis, Tulane, Rice, Air Force, Hawaii

[Uncle Rico]

It would be a good landing spot for Nebraska

[muwarrior69]

So, will the Pac whatever still have an auto bid for the tournament in 2027?

[GoldenWarrior11]

So, will the Pac whatever still have an auto bid for the tournament in 2027?

Need to get to 8 before then, but I don't think that'll be an issue.

IMO, Texas State and UTSA are probable next targets. If they say no, they can easily get UNLV and Nevada.  I think Texas is crucial for TV contract.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

The other 3 make sense but Fresno St being added over other options confuses me. Candidate pool to get to 8-10-12 teams imo assuming they don’t add Midwest/East coast teams: Gonzaga (bball only), St Mary’s (bball only), UNLV, Utah State, Wyoming, Nevada, New Mexico, New Mexico St, Idaho, Idaho St, Montana, Montana St, North Dakota St, South Dakota St, San Jose St, Sacramento St, UC Davis, Texas State, UTSA, UTEP, Memphis, Tulane, Rice, Air Force, Hawaii

Yeah a lot of these make little sense. Idaho State? UC Davis? There won’t be any FCS schools in consideration IMO.

Anyway Fresno State is a well supported program. Always good to have California teams from a recruiting perspective.

[Billy Hoyle]

Yeah a lot of these make little sense. Idaho State? UC Davis? There won’t be any FCS schools in consideration IMO.

Anyway Fresno State is a well supported program. Always good to have California teams from a recruiting perspective.

Idaho State and UC Davis wouldn't make sense for the Summit League, let alone the Pac-12. I guess this was the "look at a map and name schools I see" approach. I do find it laughable that Sac State is openly campaigning for Pac-12 membership. Yeah, that 1000 seat gym they can't sell out for hoops is going to be a selling point for a power conference. There is a better chance of Long Beach State bringing back football and joining the Pac 12 than there is Sac State getting an invite.

It also seems Pac leadership has been pretty transparent that football is a requirement for membership so that eliminates Gonzaga (SMC would be eliminated for several other reasons).  GU could now become a more attractive option for the MWC though. They will only take current FBS programs.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

Peter Thamel reporting that it looks like Air Force is close to joining the AAC.

[Billy Hoyle]

Peter Thamel reporting that it looks like Air Force is close to joining the AAC.

they're a "target" but I don't know how "close" they are to joining. AAC is reportedly talking to UNLV as well.

[Viper]

Peter Thamel reporting that it looks like Air Force is close to joining the AAC.

possibly attractive to AF since Army & Navy are already AAC members?

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

they're a "target" but I don't know how "close" they are to joining. AAC is reportedly talking to UNLV as well.

This feels like the AAC is doing the "best defense is a good offense" thing. Instead of the P12 doing the raiding, they are going to be proactive instead.

I get why Air Force would be interested in the AAC because it doesn't seem the P12 would be that interested. But UNLV?

[Uncle Rico]

This feels like the AAC is doing the "best defense is a good offense" thing. Instead of the P12 doing the raiding, they are going to be proactive instead.

I get why Air Force would be interested in the AAC because it doesn't seem the P12 would be that interested. But UNLV?

I think there is a belief UNLV is getting serious about athletics.  It’s definitely not for TV.  Their viewership numbers are amongst the worst in the Mountain West.  If the argument is market, I don’t see that.

[Billy Hoyle]

I think there is a belief UNLV is getting serious about athletics.  It’s definitely not for TV.  Their viewership numbers are amongst the worst in the Mountain West.  If the argument is market, I don’t see that.

UNLV doesn't draw. Football has been averaging under 20K a game the past two seasons and that average is usually bolstered by non-conference road fans coming in. Basketball has fallen off too. The past few seasons they have been below 6k. With pro sports throughout the college season now ,they just aren't a draw. The days of "Gucci Row" at UNLV games are long gone and not coming back.

[Uncle Rico]

UNLV doesn't draw. Football has been averaging under 20K a game the past two seasons and that average is usually bolstered by non-conference road fans coming in. Basketball has fallen off too. The past few seasons they have been below 6k. With pro sports throughout the college season now ,they just aren't a draw.

The idea of Vegas is probably appealing to TV people more than the reality of Vegas