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GoldenWarrior11

Loyola, in present form, is not getting invited to the Big East.  Their arena is too small, they are - at present - unable to spend as much as their Big East counterparts and - unfortunately - the Chicago market (between DePaul and Loyola combined) do not consistently crack over 10k.  Now, things can change.  I would love nothing more as a Chicagoan, a Jesuit graduate (of multiple schools) and hoops fan.  Moser has built something really special and has transformed Loyola into one of the top mid-major programs in the country (not unlike Marshall did at Wichita State).

I don't see a NE-based league doubling-up in Chicago, with two programs that struggle to get high attendance figures.  If Loyola was like Creighton or Dayton, I could see it. 

Loyola can (and should) be considered for the A10 or AAC.  They would be outstanding fits in either of those conferences (more so the A10).  If the A10 could replace Loyola with Fordham, they would do so in a heartbeat. 

Tums Festival

Quote from: Galway Eagle on March 23, 2021, 03:47:40 PM
I know Seton Hall isn't in New York but I mean come on, they're like the same distance to St Johns as DePaul's loop campus to Loyola's Rogers Park campus.

Well, there really isn't a rivalry between DePaul and Loyola considering the last time they played each other was in 2012. DePaul really doesn't have much of a rivalry with anybody since they've sucked for so long.

And as someone else posted, if the Big East were to add another team it would make more sense to add a new market.
"Every day ends with a Tums festival!"

Tums Festival

Quote from: GooooMarquette on March 23, 2021, 04:19:20 PM

Absolutely a big gamble, but he gives the appearance of having a high upside.

I think TAMU described him best as "high risk, high reward."

How is he a "big gamble?" Is he a bigger gamble than KO, Crean, and Steve? They all were outsiders with no head coaching experience, whereas Gates has his two years at Cleveland St.
"Every day ends with a Tums festival!"

muwarrior69

#103
Quote from: nyg on March 23, 2021, 01:44:31 PM
I believe Gates will be the next coach.

He checks all the boxes with the exception of a lengthy tenure as a head coach. But he is a head coach, not an assistant.

-Former college player and was from Chicago

-Grad Assistant at MU, yes only a year but he was there.

-Assistant at FSU for 10 years.  Learned under Hamilton at a big school which had numerous NCAA Tournament appearances.  Was the lead recruiter at FSU, so he checks the box of having ties with the AAU circuits.  He probably knew Carton, Garcia and Lewis from the AAU circuit scene and they know him. You can google his former FSU players and see what they said about him ,especially some NBA players.

-Head coach experience.  Some will guess on that experience, but he was Coach of the Year and his players really like him.

-No baggage.

-Afro American Coach

-Gates is I believe 41, so he is younger than the other candidates being discussed.  I saw it with Boynton at Oklahoma State and how the players were reacting with him.  It was just different and they actually looked like they were having fun.

- No players have left yet and no recruits have decommitted subsequent to Wojo leaving.  Maybe Scholl told them all, "Listen guys, its going to take a few weeks, but you guys are really going to like our new coach, so just hold on and see".
Whether he hinted at whom that may be, no one here will know.

-Scholl said he was looking for a current/former head coach, with no baggage and that diversity was going the play a role in the hiring process.  All the Scholl boxes checked off.  Now, if granted an interview and he bombs, that's another story. 

Hope I am right, seems like a nice fit.  But when the new coach is hired, no one will be statisfied.


.

Did he actually say that? What does diversity mean? So if Gates and Moser both want the job and all the boxes are checked it comes down to this?

nyg

Quote from: muwarrior69 on March 23, 2021, 04:36:46 PM
Did he actually say that? What does diversity mean? So if Gates and Moser both want the job and all the boxes are checked it comes down to this?

Watch the video or go to one of the threads, can't recall which one, but yes.

What is diversity, well that is including persons of color in the consideration of hiring.

I have no idea what Scholl would do if it came down to a white candidate or an Afro American candidate.  Thats another topic of discussion and has been addressed here.   

Macallan 18

Quote from: muwarrior69 on March 23, 2021, 04:36:46 PM
Did he actually say that? What does diversity mean? So if Gates and Moser both want the job and all the boxes are checked it comes down to this?

No, it will come down to who has the best PowerPoint presentation.

brewcity77

#106
Quote from: muwarrior69 on March 23, 2021, 04:36:46 PM
Did he actually say that? What does diversity mean? So if Gates and Moser both want the job and all the boxes are checked it comes down to this?

I don't know what it means to him, but here's how I describe it to anyone who comes to work for me and why it's important.

Diversity isn't just about race or gender, it's about age, background, and experiences. I want as diverse a work environment as possible because the more varied experiences we have, the more likely it is that at least one of us will be able to relate to the people we serve on a daily basis and the broader the opinions the more likely it is someone will be able to come up with ideas and solutions others may not think of.

When I think Wojo's staff, I think part of the problem is that more and more, he surrounded himself with people that he had groomed, which means they were just going to give him the same ideas he had passed onto them. His first staff had Mark Phelps, who had the head coaching experience Steve didn't, but when that left, it was replaced with a young recruiter. I liked the staff where he had Brett Nelson, Stan Johnson, and Dwayne Killings because it was three guys from different parts of the country and vastly different backgrounds, but the problem was there still wasn't an experienced head in there (like Wainwright with Buzz, Orr with Ewing, Martelli with Juwan Howard, etc).

And when those staff members started to leave, instead of bringing in people who had different backgrounds, Wojo just promoted his own guys. Presutti was promoted and had been there from the start, so his coaching acumen was going to largely mirror Wojo's. Gainey left for a couple years, but was another that Wojo brought up and would likely mostly mirror what Wojo was doing.

I hope our new coach, whoever it is, has a variety of experience, recruiting territories, and backgrounds. It's likely to lead to a stronger staff and team because everyone can bring in more ideas. I often wonder if that's a big part of why so many Duke assistants fail, because they simply don't have more tools in the toolbox than how to win with 5-stars.

EDIT: Also, if Wojo was just going to fill Killings' spot with someone like Danny Mads, who has also been there his entire tenure, that may not have gone over well with Scholl.
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jesmu84

Quote from: muwarrior69 on March 23, 2021, 04:36:46 PM
Did he actually say that? What does diversity mean? So if Gates and Moser both want the job and all the boxes are checked it comes down to this?

Man. You really get triggered by any mention of diversity/race

muwarrior69

Quote from: jesmu84 on March 23, 2021, 05:20:46 PM
Man. You really get triggered by any mention of diversity/race

I only bring it up because if an interviewed candidate did not get the job they could claim discrimination based on what the AD said publicly that diversity/race by your definition was a consideration in the hiring process. My take is that he should have said nothing about diversity and left it at that. I appreciate Brews perspective on the subject.

Tums Festival

Quote from: muwarrior69 on March 23, 2021, 04:36:46 PM
Did he actually say that? What does diversity mean? So if Gates and Moser both want the job and all the boxes are checked it comes down to this?

Diversity isn't only about a person's ethnicity.
"Every day ends with a Tums festival!"

muwarrior69


Hards Alumni

Quote from: muwarrior69 on March 23, 2021, 05:42:40 PM
I only bring it up because if an interviewed candidate did not get the job they could claim discrimination based on what the AD said publicly that diversity/race by your definition was a consideration in the hiring process. My take is that he should have said nothing about diversity and left it at that. I appreciate Brews perspective on the subject.

what?  no.

GooooMarquette

Quote from: Tums Festival on March 23, 2021, 04:36:32 PM
How is he a "big gamble?" Is he a bigger gamble than KO, Crean, and Steve? They all were outsiders with no head coaching experience, whereas Gates has his two years at Cleveland St.


Bigger than KO, Crean or Wojo? No.

He is a big gamble because he has limited head coaching experience. KO, Crean and Steve were HUGE gambles.

Most every new hire is a big gamble, unless you're a UK or UNC hiring a guy like Cal or Roy.

For MU, I think least risky of the plausibly available candidates is Moser. Even he is a moderate gamble, but IMO less risky than Gates or Smith.

For what it's worth, I still think Gates is worth the gamble because his potential upside seems so great.

Tums Festival

"Every day ends with a Tums festival!"

PGsHeroes32

I would like a hire like Belein but its not happening. I actually think Shaka could really rebound here. But also, not happening.


Ultimately I think its Gates or Moser. No insider info but I think its one of these two.

From a coaching stand point I think Moser is clearly the safer bet. Hes absolutely proven as a coach.

I do think Gates background and age will make him a better recruiter(potentially a very good one). But could run the risk of proving he isnt that great of a coach and its basically Wojo again.

I'll take either of the two. Just hope we have some sort of roster next year.
Lazar picking up where the BIG 3 left off....

WarriorHal

#115
Gates resume is certainly impressive, especially for guy that's still young -- 41. But if were to have success at MU, which seems highly likely, we might be a stepping stone for him and we'd have to look for yet another head coach in just a few years. At 52, Moser would seem more likely to stay at MU for the rest of his career. He might be difficult to get though, with Indiana & their big $$$ also looking for a coach. If MU can't land Moser, Gates would be a great choice. Just hope MU & the Big East is big enough for him and he stays a long time.

Texas seems to be imploding with more players leaving today. Maybe Smart will get the ax. But MU wasn't a high profile enough job for him seven years ago. It might be now, but screw him. He's the last guy I'd want at MU.

Goatherder

Quote from: Pakuni on March 23, 2021, 04:12:19 PM
Gotcha.
The Big East is going to kick out a founding member with a storied basketball history, state-of-the-art 19,000-seat arena and rabid fanbase so they can add a second team which draws about 3,330 fans per game, gets little media attention in its home town when it's not on a tourney run, and plays in an existing market.
Makes perfect sense, now that I think about it.

I do not know why the Big East would kick anybody out, or why it would want to.  I posted this on another board.

I have said before that if the Big East expands, Loyola could be a candidate. I do not know if it will happen soon. DePaul is down and Loyola is up, which is the wrong time from DePaul's point of view to be adding a team. Loyola's home arena still only seats about 4-6.000. If they were to join, they could play some of their games on campus like Nova or SJU and some elsewhere, but oddly enough, the logical place for them to play them would be DePaul's WinTrust arena, which is about 4-5 miles further from Loyola than it is from DePaul.

Chicago is big enough that it could support two Big East teams. Actually, SJU, Seton Hall, and UConn pretty much share the same media market, and one of the advantages of returning for UConn was the ability to snag a deal with the NYC-based cable network.

When the conference reorganized, SLU was one of the hot names and was apparently considered before Creighton stepped in and stole thier spot. The view of the other schools was that SLU had just not stepped up their program to the same level as the others. Dayton would be another obvious choice, but they are right near Xavier and it does not appear that Xavier wants them. It does seem that with UConn back, it makes sense to round out the conference with a twelfth team. UConn's addition puts six teams on the East Coast and five in the MIdwest. Adding another in the Midwest would even that out. It would immediately restore rivalries with DePaul and Marquette, and traveling into Chicago from the East Coast is relatively easy. Actually, adding another team in the metro area can work to the benefit of the nearby teams. It is sort of like all those fast food places lumped together or all the bridal stores on MItchell Street. That becomes the place you go to find what you need. Two schools in Chicago plus Marquette and Butler relatively easy driving distance makes the Big East an attractive location for Chicago area or really Midwest area players. Assuming that it could afford the step up for all of its programs, not just men's basketball, it would be a no-brainer for Loyola. Of course it means competing with Loyola for recruits, but if they continue to improve, teams are going to have to do that anyway.

TAMU, Knower of Ball

Quote from: PGsHeroes32 on March 23, 2021, 09:08:53 PM
I would like a hire like Belein but its not happening. I actually think Shaka could really rebound here. But also, not happening.

I didn't think so at the beginning but I'm beginning to believe that it could happen. Moser has definitely helped his stock this week.
Quote from: Goose on January 15, 2023, 08:43:46 PM
TAMU

I do know, Newsie is right on you knowing ball.


Viper

Quote from: WarriorHal on March 23, 2021, 09:15:25 PM
Gates resume is certainly impressive, especially for guy that's still young -- 41. But if were to have success at MU, which seems highly likely, we might be a stepping stone for him and we'd have to look for yet another head coach in just a few years. At 52, Moser would seem more likely to stay at MU for the rest of his career. He might be difficult to get though, with Indiana & their big $$$ also looking for a coach. If MU can't land Moser, Gates would be a great choice. Just hope MU & the Big East is big enough for him and he stays a long time.

Texas seems to be imploding with more players leaving today. Maybe Smart will get the ax. But MU wasn't a high profile enough job for him seven years ago. It might be now, but screw him. He's the last guy I'd want at MU.
I hear you, but I wouldn't worry 'bout down the road a few. This has got to get turned around now. The future of 5, 6 years will work it's way out.
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PBRme

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MuggsyB

I'm not in the know but am hearing they completed 4 interviews and that Smart and Moser stood out.  If it's Shaka we'll likely hear very soon. 


onepost

Have also heard more chatter that Shaka to Marquette could very well be happening.
Certainly not #DoneDeal 'ing myself but given the source I'm inclined to believe it has legs.

JakeBarnes

Quote from: MuggsyB on March 24, 2021, 12:00:28 PM
I'm not in the know but am hearing they completed 4 interviews and that Smart and Moser stood out.  If it's Shaka we'll likely hear very soon.

Thanks for the heads up. Can Moser actually interview at this point?
Assume what I say should be in teal if it doesn't pass the smell test for you.

"We all carry within us our places of exile, our crimes and our ravages. But our task is not to unleash them on the world; it is to fight them in ourselves and in others." -Camus, The Rebel

StillAWarrior

Quote from: Marq3332 on March 24, 2021, 11:26:52 AM
I hear you, but I wouldn't worry 'bout down the road a few. This has got to get turned around now. The future of 5, 6 years will work it's way out.

After the last seven years, I have fond, sentimental memories of a time when we worried that another program would come and hire our coach away. Obviously, I don't want that. But I fear it's a fact of life at Marquette; if we do well, there will always be talk of someone poaching our coach. We can all dream of our very own Mark Few...and maybe there's one out there for us...but I really don't think our hiring strategy should be to focus on finding a unicorn. Hire the best coach available who fits into Marquette's culture. Period.
Never wrestle with a pig.  You both get dirty, and the pig likes it.

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