Pro-Jos V. No-Jos

[StillAWarrior]

Just be sure to repeat it after every half played.

To quote a noted philosopher, "I don't care who ya are...that's funny right there."

[MU82]

There are definitely extreme projos. They are the "all in on Wojo" crew. Chico (the manic side of your split personality) is the best example.

Then there are the basic projos. Lean hard in his direction but aren't 100% all in/convinced - Tower, MU82 and others.

The so-so jos are next. They see equal parts good and bad and are keeping their powder dry - Fluffy, myself and others.

Then the basic nojos. They've seen enough to think he's not the one but still hope he'll prove them wrong - Goose, 4ever, etc.

Then the extreme nojos. Think he already should have been fired. Hold no hope for him whatsoever - maybe PRN, surely others.

You and your alter ego are extreme projos. You view that as reasonable (naturally), but your view is no less skewed than the extreme nojos (or anyone else's). Period.

Enjoyed this, Lenny, and can't argue with what you say. I might shift a few folks one up or down the category line, but that would be nitpicking.

I will say that some of the extreme nojos do occasionally go WAY out there: "I'll take DePaul's program right now" ... "Wojo isn't even as good as Deane" ... "Wojo de-motivates his players," etc. And of course one of the "basic nojos" you list does tend to celebrate every time Wojo misses on a recruit.

I guess one could argue that projos are always throwing out the career paths of Wright, K, etc ... but then again I don't ever hear them saying Wojo is BETTER than Wright and K or that Wojo will one day become Wright and K.

Anyhoo, it's all a part of what makes Scoop "special."

We Are Marquette!

[tower912]

But, he also hasn't lived up to the lofty expectations of people who were more projo (I'm thinking tower here - who is significantly more reserved about Wojo this year than he has been).

I am exactly where I have been every year on Wojo.  Right now, MU is within one game of where I thought they would be at this point.   If anything, I am slightly more optimistic after seeing the class Wojo was able to land post-Hauser, as well as how much potential I see in Symir.

I have never gone full Anikin to Darth Wojo-us.   I have always acknowledged whatever shortcomings I perceive.   I watch the trend; his in game coaching, recruiting, clean program, etc. I look at who might replace him.   On balance, I like MU's chances at success more maintaining the status quo versus starting from scratch again.   
   It helps that I don't lose my crap over losses to good teams either neutral court or on the road.   And that I genuinely like the make up of this team.    Easy to root for.

[MUBBau]

I am exactly where I have been every year on Wojo.  Right now, MU is within one game of where I thought they would be at this point.   If anything, I am slightly more optimistic after seeing the class Wojo was able to land post-Hauser, as well as how much potential I see in Symir.

I have never gone full Anikin to Darth Wojo-us.   I have always acknowledged whatever shortcomings I perceive.   I watch the trend; his in game coaching, recruiting, clean program, etc. I look at who might replace him.   On balance, I like MU's chances at success more maintaining the status quo versus starting from scratch again.   
   It helps that I don't lose my crap over losses to good teams either neutral court or on the road.   And that I genuinely like the make up of this team.    Easy to root for.

[Dawson Rental]

I’m solidly in the So-So Jo camp. He’s a good guy who isn’t a terrible coach by any means, but if either party decided to move on at the end of this year, I would be fine with that.

Oh, nooooo!  Not this year, not with that recruiting class coming in, and not with how recruiting looks for next year....

I can still remember a very nice class in Buzz's last year evaporating with just Sandy Cohn getting salvaged.  And then Wojo struggling with a very short rotation his first year.  Let's not do that again.  Please

[WhoaJoe2020]

"Long-time lurker" WhoaJoe2020 just read the board passively for a good long time and now all of a sudden has manic diarrhea of the keyboard repeating Wojo-defending talking points ad nauseam. Interesting!

This is the second time you posted this I believe. You or anyone else on the board have my permission to have my user status verified. This is the FIRST time I have ever posted on scoop. I also responded to your other post and explained why I am posting so much. I find it cathartic to vent  after being silent for so long. I'm sure it will drop off very soon. I might even leave the board if people keep making false statements about me personally. I am always up for a reasonable debate but when one participants arguments seem purposefully designed to antagonize and do not add facts to support their position, I begin to see them as trolls.
Kinda like what you did.

[Silkk the Shaka]

This is the second time you posted this I believe. You or anyone else on the board have my permission to have my user status verified. This is the FIRST time I have ever posted on scoop. I also responded to your other post and explained why I am posting so much. I find it cathartic to vent  after being silent for so long. I'm sure it will drop off very soon. I might even leave the board if people keep making false statements about me personally. I am always up for a reasonable debate but when one participants arguments seem purposefully designed to antagonize and do not add facts to support their position, I begin to see them as trolls.
Kinda like what you did.

LOL

[WhoaJoe2020]

There are definitely extreme projos. They are the "all in on Wojo" crew. Chico (the manic side of your split personality) is the best example.

Then there are the basic projos. Lean hard in his direction but aren't 100% all in/convinced - Tower, MU82 and others.

The so-so jos are next. They see equal parts good and bad and are keeping their powder dry - Fluffy, myself and others.

Then the basic nojos. They've seen enough to think he's not the one but still hope he'll prove them wrong - Goose, 4ever, etc.

Then the extreme nojos. Think he already should have been fired. Hold no hope for him whatsoever - maybe PRN, surely others.

You and your alter ego are extreme projos. You view that as reasonable (naturally), but your view is no less skewed than the extreme nojos (or anyone else's). Period.

I appreciate your argument but I have to disagree.

I nor any poster I have read has ever exaggerated Wojos accomplishments and called for him to be proclaimed GCOAT. That would be an extreme ProJo

I have read posters acknowledging the situation he inherited, citing his decent recruiting, pointing to his positive winning trend, seeing some improvement in his coaching, specifically on the defensive end and player usage , and recognizing the clean program he is running. They also expressed their fear of losing a developing coach and possibly his star recruits( and maybe key transfers like Symir)and having to start from scratch again.
At the same time these same posters have expressed disappointment in Wojos lack of tournament success and his inability to have the players focused and prepared consistently. I am not informed enough to intelligently opine on his in game adjustments but I and others have also questioned his reluctance/stubbornness to employ a zone defense in certain situations.  I can also honestly say that if the facts change and winning and recruiting start trending negative I'll have no problem  supporting his removal. I consider myself and most others reasonable, rational Jos

Then there are those who post comments promoting the argument that Wojo has been a train wreck and suggest that the situation he inherited was almost ideal. They postulate that he can't coach at all,  his recruiting is average, he can't develop players, he can't win big games, he's not a good representative for the program, and if he stays there's no chance of Marquette ever being competitive in the tournament. Most of their statements are demonstrably false.
These are extreme NoJos

[Lennys Tap]

I appreciate your argument but I have to disagree.

I nor any poster I have read has ever exaggerated Wojos accomplishments and called for him to be proclaimed GCOAT. That would be an extreme ProJo

I have read posters acknowledging the situation he inherited, citing his decent recruiting, pointing to his positive winning trend, seeing some improvement in his coaching, specifically on the defensive end and player usage , and recognizing the clean program he is running. They also expressed their fear of losing a developing coach and possibly his star recruits( and maybe key transfers like Symir)and having to start from scratch again.
At the same time these same posters have expressed disappointment in Wojos lack of tournament success and his inability to have the players focused and prepared consistently. I am not informed enough to intelligently opine on his in game adjustments but I and others have also questioned his reluctance/stubbornness to employ a zone defense in certain situations.  I can also honestly say that if the facts change and winning and recruiting start trending negative I'll have no problem  supporting his removal. I consider myself and most others reasonable, rational Jos

Then there are those who post comments promoting the argument that Wojo has been a train wreck and suggest that the situation he inherited was almost ideal. They postulate that he can't coach at all,  his recruiting is average, he can't develop players, he can't win big games, he's not a good representative for the program, and if he stays there's no chance of Marquette ever being competitive in the tournament. Most of their statements are demonstrably false.
These are extreme NoJos

So much off the wall hyperbole and so many outright falsehoods in your post it they don’t deserve a sentence by sentence enumeration. Basically total BS.

[WhoaJoe2020]

So much off the wall hyperbole and so many outright falsehoods in your post it they don’t deserve a sentence by sentence enumeration. Basically total BS.

You have read some of the Wojo debate comments littered throughout the threads, right?!?! It wasn't my words I was citing to define extreme NoJos, it was theirs. If you have an issue with falsehoods and hyperbole direct your complaints to them.

[1SE]

I am exactly where I have been every year on Wojo.  Right now, MU is within one game of where I thought they would be at this point.   If anything, I am slightly more optimistic after seeing the class Wojo was able to land post-Hauser, as well as how much potential I see in Symir.

I have never gone full Anikin to Darth Wojo-us.   I have always acknowledged whatever shortcomings I perceive.   I watch the trend; his in game coaching, recruiting, clean program, etc. I look at who might replace him.   On balance, I like MU's chances at success more maintaining the status quo versus starting from scratch again.   
   It helps that I don't lose my crap over losses to good teams either neutral court or on the road.   And that I genuinely like the make up of this team.    Easy to root for.

Yes, I know you always have low expectations in any given season but I think in the early years you were pretty optimistic about where we'd be in year 5+. I'm  not going to dig through old posts so I could be misremembering. But to your credit I think you've made a few comments this year that Wojo might not be the one. Again, that strikes me as a departure from the faith I remember you having a few years ago.

[WhoaJoe2020]

LOL

People often laugh when they can't formulate an intelligent response.
 
Then again,  someone willing to make an uninformed, unsubstantiated, and ultimately false statement directed at another poster can't be that smart to begin with.

[Silkk the Shaka]

People often laugh when they can't formulate an intelligent response.
 
Then again,  someone willing to make an uninformed, unsubstantiated, and ultimately false statement directed at another poster can't be that smart to begin with.

LOL

[WhoaJoe2020]

LOL

Yeah, I thought so.

[4everwarriors]

All youse projoe's still feelin' it, hey?

[jesmu84]

All youse projoe's still feelin' it, hey?

Yes.

Why didn't you ask this after Nova?

[NickelDimer]

Yes.

Why didn't you ask this after Nova?

If you think Wojo isn’t losing supporters with games like tonight, you’d be wrong.

[jesmu84]

If you think Wojo isn’t losing supporters with games like tonight, you’d be wrong.

Is that what I said or implied?

[NickelDimer]

Is that what I said or implied?

I think by backhandedly insulting the question you did imply that, yes.

[jesmu84]

I think by backhandedly insulting the question you did imply that, yes.

I meant to insult the question because "piling on the loss to prove your point" crowd is tiresome. A bunch of clowns.

[JWags85]

Yes.

Why didn't you ask this after Nova?

Nova was a great win but didn’t exactly counter anything. The team came out on fire, but went almost 8 min in the second half without scoring while Wojo stood with his hand in his pockets using no TOs and letting them twist in the wind. The deficit was too large and the defense was fairly good, so they rode it out. But it was the same issue tonight, a long stretch with no semblance of a time out or chance to regroup from the coach. We didn’t win at Nova because he out coached Jay Wright

In 6 halves (no OT) in the last 3 games, the team has been lost or out of sorts offensively for 5 of them. That’s beyond concerning

[warriors141]

If you think Wojo isn’t losing supporters with games like tonight, you’d be wrong.

probably true, which is sad. The more fans that are happy with mediocrity the lesss relevant we become. Just look at depaul

[jesmu84]

Nova was a great win but didn’t exactly counter anything. The team came out on fire, but went almost 8 min in the second half without scoring while Wojo stood with his hand in his pockets using no TOs and letting them twist in the wind. The deficit was too large and the defense was fairly good, so they rode it out. But it was the same issue tonight, a long stretch with no semblance of a time out or chance to regroup from the coach. We didn’t win at Nova because he out coached Jay Wright

In 6 halves (no OT) in the last 3 games, the team has been lost or out of sorts offensively for 5 of them. That’s beyond concerning

I get that. I watched.

See above.

[Goose]

jesmu

Few pile on after a loss. More and more comment after a loss, but very little piling on. Wojo has 5+ years and has felt little heat.
Would add, simple way to avoid criticism, win the home games against bottom teams in the BE.

[auburnmarquette]

Whoa-Joe - shouldn't you be game planning and not posting here!?!

Lol touche. I'm a pro-jo too and actually agree with the original post here, but Rocky's response is funny. Can't remember if it was Rocky or someone else way back who asked me if I'd finished picking up Tom Crean's laundry yet.

Speaking of which - since it seemed most were anti-crean - nice win for him at Memphis and tonight is beating Kentucky so far. Not bad!