Stealing Tower's Thunder

[Herman Cain]

Life could be worse. We only had to travel to Omaha to get blown out.

https://www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/court-report-maine-travels-nearly-11000-miles-the-longest-ever-road-game-trip-to-lose-by-40/

[dgies9156]

Here's the challenge: We're five years in with our current coach and we're not to where we think we ought to be. In fact, those of us who remember the glory days know we're a long way from where we should be.

Perhaps that's obvious but one of the things that concerns me is what the objectives for the program really are? If we continue to lay eggs like Creighton, how long will it be before attendance at the Computing Castle for our games wanes. Particularly when the Milwaukee Bucks are good again and the Packers and Brewers both are showing signs of life.

Lower attendance means lower revenue. Lower revenue means less resources to do the things the university needs to do. In addition, without a top tier basketball program, does Marquette's national recognition as an institution of higher learning also wane? These are the real issues surrounding our program and should be addressed sooner rather than later.

Nobody is arguing Wojo isn't a person of character. The people around him and the folks that play for us appear by all measures to be decent human beings. And, frankly, I want Wojo to succeed as soon as possible. But, like most of the folks in here, I'm afraid for where we really are — a very ordinary program with mostly average talent and an inability to step up. Garcia and Oso may be part of the answer but they'll be freshmen and that's a lot to put on freshmen.

What we have is a shrewder version of Mike Deane. Wojo recruits better but Deane was a much better in-game coach. 

Look, I hope I have to eat some of these words come March. But the losses this year have been telling — Wisconsin, Maryland and now Creighton. All were blow-outs. All had Wojo out-coached and our team "out-thought." All are teams we have to defeat if we intend to make the tournament and be successful in it.

I hate rebuilds but I'm close to thinking we're better off with one than to move through a few more seasons rudderless.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Lack of interior scoring is a huge problem. Our bigs simply cannot score. Our guards don't seem to be quick enough to take it to the basket. I thought this wouldn't be a problem this year but it clearly is.

And yeah put Markus back at point. I know that will result in some turnovers but he is simply not touching the ball enough.

And Wojo's lack of adjustments continues to be a problem.

[hairy worthen]

Everyone needs to calm down a bit...We lost a game we were supposed to lose. We have won every game this year we were supposed to win. Winning in Omaha probably wasn't going to happen this year if we played well & Creighton will not lose many games at home. I agree that it's concerning and disappointing the way we lost, but these games happen every single year (usually to worse teams). Time to focus on Nova & hopefully this served as a wake up call!

I don't understand that logic. So if the team sucks and is only supposed to win 2 games that's ok because we won the two we were supposed to win?  I agree with you it is only one game, lets see what happens, but the discouraging thing to me is how we are losing these games and the fact that it does happen every year.

[Eye]

Hard to improve much on Dgies post. That's about where I'm at right now. Had the same thoughts on comparison to Deane while watching last night's game. I live about a 2 1/2 hour drive away and try to attend most weekend home Big East games, and weekend non-conference home games against high-major opponents. As of now, leaning on not coming Saturday. Not worth 8 hours of my time to watch very average basketball. If I'm coming to Milwaukee Saturday, it'll be to watch the Bucks, not MU.

[1SE]

If this is the low point of the conference season then I'm fine with it but it's hard to imagine a worse start.

[jsglow]

Dgies, I said essentially the exact same thing to the former BOT Chair roughly 30 days ago. I'm not sure I'm at liberty to share his side of the conversation other than to say that the Board remains firmly in Wojo's camp. So there's that. Let's hope for better things Saturday.

[mubb3434]

I don't understand that logic. So if the team sucks and is only supposed to win 2 games that's ok because we won the two we were supposed to win?  I agree with you it is only one game, lets see what happens, but the discouraging thing to me is how we are losing these games and the fact that it does happen every year.

No...That's not what I'm saying. The point in trying to make is that it is 1 game and that these games happen literally every year. From my perspective, at least it happened in a game we were supposed to lose instead of Providence at home. I agree that it's disappointing and concerning, but no reason to throw the white flag up...Yet...

[WolfganghisKhan]

Can we stop running the PnR with the big men. Opposing teams just double the ball handler and we have no idea how to get out of it. The forward should be the person setting the screen. Our 1 & 5 pick n roll is the most useless play we run.

[hairy worthen]

No...That's not what I'm saying. The point in trying to make is that it is 1 game and that these games happen literally every year. From my perspective, at least it happened in a game we were supposed to lose instead of Providence at home. I agree that it's disappointing and concerning, but no reason to throw the white flag up...Yet...

Agree, For some reason the losses this year seem different, like they will not recover and be ok. Maybe it's because of the Hauser thing and not knowing what to expect.

[MUBBau]

As of now, leaning on not coming Saturday. Not worth 8 hours of my time to watch very average basketball. If I'm coming to Milwaukee Saturday, it'll be to watch the Bucks, not MU.

Good, give your ticket(s) to someone who likes the team

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

If this is the low point of the conference season then I'm fine with it but it's hard to imagine a worse start.

You have a short memory then. We lost by 3 more points to a worse St. John's team last season.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

Dgies, I said essentially the exact same thing to the former BOT Chair roughly 30 days ago. I'm not sure I'm at liberty to share his side of the conversation other than to say that the Board remains firmly in Wojo's camp. So there's that. Let's hope for better things Saturday.

This is why I have completely lowered my expectations for the program.  It's just not worth expecting something that the university isn't committed to.

[Goose]

Frenns

Similar feelings here.

[1SE]

You have a short memory then. We lost by 3 more points to a worse St. John's team last season.

Not of any conference season, of this conference season.

[Cheeks]

This is why I have completely lowered my expectations for the program.  It's just not worth expecting something that the university isn't committed to.

The university isn't committed to?  Let me make sure I understand this....are we playing at the Al the rest of the season?  Did we cut all the budgets?  Are we withdrawing to the Horizon League?  Exactly what are we not doing from a commitment perspective?

[SaveOD238]

I don't think Bailey is our second best player. I don't think he's the second best scoring option either. He's not top 3 in any statistical category. He's got upside, but he's not showing it consistently enough yet.

I think right now Sacar is the only other consistent option on the floor. He gets to the rim regularly, and despite his issues finishing, he's still scoring regularly. He's also really improved his 3pt shooting, now being a good enough shooter to knock down open shots consistently and even making a few tougher shots. He's also a good on ball defender, a decent enough rebounder, and he makes fewer mental mistakes than most of the rest of the team. To me, he's the second most important guy and the second best for us.

Sacar probably is our second best option right now.  But Sacar is a decidedly mediocre high-major player.  He starts and plays a lot of minutes because he is an older, experienced, smart player but he is not a great or super-talented player by any means.  He's #2 in scoring, but also takes 10+ shots a game, 17 last night.  Sacar is our #2 because he has to be, but he is inefficient and does nothing to wow.

Going forward, its great to have an excellent #1 option like we have had in Carlino, Rowsey, and now Markus.  But we need to do better than the dime-a-dozen Sacar Anim's of the world to be competitive into March.

[Herman Cain]

Here's the challenge: We're five years in with our current coach and we're not to where we think we ought to be. In fact, those of us who remember the glory days know we're a long way from where we should be.

Perhaps that's obvious but one of the things that concerns me is what the objectives for the program really are? If we continue to lay eggs like Creighton, how long will it be before attendance at the Computing Castle for our games wanes. Particularly when the Milwaukee Bucks are good again and the Packers and Brewers both are showing signs of life.

Lower attendance means lower revenue. Lower revenue means less resources to do the things the university needs to do. In addition, without a top tier basketball program, does Marquette's national recognition as an institution of higher learning also wane? These are the real issues surrounding our program and should be addressed sooner rather than later.

Nobody is arguing Wojo isn't a person of character. The people around him and the folks that play for us appear by all measures to be decent human beings. And, frankly, I want Wojo to succeed as soon as possible. But, like most of the folks in here, I'm afraid for where we really are — a very ordinary program with mostly average talent and an inability to step up. Garcia and Oso may be part of the answer but they'll be freshmen and that's a lot to put on freshmen.

What we have is a shrewder version of Mike Deane. Wojo recruits better but Deane was a much better in-game coach. 

Look, I hope I have to eat some of these words come March. But the losses this year have been telling — Wisconsin, Maryland and now Creighton. All were blow-outs. All had Wojo out-coached and our team "out-thought." All are teams we have to defeat if we intend to make the tournament and be successful in it.

I hate rebuilds but I'm close to thinking we're better off with one than to move through a few more seasons rudderless.

I agree with this analysis.

[connie]

This is why I have completely lowered my expectations for the program.  It's just not worth expecting something that the university isn't committed to.

The fan part of me keeps fighting against this, but it gets harder every year.

[Mike Deane's Seat Belt]

The athletic department and knights of the round table at the university will certainly have to do something when the fiserv forum gets less and less full in the next few seasons. 

If it gets bad enough i dont think going back to the AL or arena etc are completely ruled out.

The panic will most definitely ensue if the lower bowl seats start to become readily available. 

[Dr. Blackheart]

A couple of more points to expand.

The Creighton offensive game plan was to get our guards in foul trouble early. Post-up Markus, drive at Koby, run and advance in transition, dribble drive on Sacar, paint touches. This was the first time all year with our depth that MU was in early foul trouble. No one off the bench stepped up.

As TAMU pointed out, Wojo's game plan on defense was to extend out on the perimeter like the scheme a few years ago when Rowsey was here. As Wojo said postgame, MU is an inside-out defense but the plan was to press out instead...and Creighton exploited the horrible on ball defense executed. Yet, Creighton was having its way on MU both inside and outside. MU needs to get back to what it can do well and that's protecting the paint.

As we discussed in the past, if MU is to be successful this year, it will take a village to replace the Hausers. Frankly, the effort yesterday, with maybe the exception of Bailey, was not Big East, including and especially the coaches.

The conference grind is brutal, teams know each other well, the coaching is top notch. The good news is MU has the chance to get back on the bike. How and who steps up Saturday will be one to watch. Wojo has a pretty good record of responding, but time will tell.

[Golden Avalanche]

This is why I have completely lowered my expectations for the program.  It's just not worth expecting something that the university isn't committed to.

What were your expectations when Wojo was hired?

What are your expectations now that they've been lowered since Wojo was hired?

[dgies9156]

Dgies, I said essentially the exact same thing to the former BOT Chair roughly 30 days ago. I'm not sure I'm at liberty to share his side of the conversation other than to say that the Board remains firmly in Wojo's camp. So there's that. Let's hope for better things Saturday.

First off, I'm not surprised you said that to a former BOT member. You were smart enough to marry a Father Ryan spouse!

That aside, of course the BOT is in Wojo's camp. They will be until those lower bowl seats "become available." Or until our games are programmed and scheduled between Evening Devotional, Joel Osteen and Looney Toons on Aurora Community Cable Channel 894. Or until they realize that being DePaul and living off conference revenue rather that creating a name for yourself isn't enough.

Indeed, it's not enough to be a mediocre Big East team. Ask Georgetown why they went to the extreme measure of firing the Thompson family? They knew what they had to do if they expected to reach their glory days again. I'm not there yet but clearly if we have too many more debacles like Creighton, then, well, the revenue will start to fall. The university must nip that in the bud fast because donors aren't going to make up for a lack of revenue commitment because of a lack of winning basketball.

[GoldenDieners32]

Lots of things you can point at lack of this, lack of that, etc . But it all leads back to wojo lack of coaching

[PGsHeroes32]

I disagree.  This year's team will be lucky to make the NCAA Tournament, and maybe, just maybe could sneak into the Top 25.  But I don't see this year's team going on 6-7 game win streak and beating quality Big East teams on the road.

Last years BE was not nearly as strong as this years