Fire Buzz Williams memory lane thread

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Why would they need to make excuses for the the most successful coach in school history? They should enjoy an incredible ride they thought they would never have.

They (and most MU fans) won't be making "excuses". They'll be remembering fondly the best and (in MU's case) the second best eras in their school's basketball history.

Don't waste your time being embarrassed for them or us. Be embarrassed for yourself.

I enjoyed Buzz's time here.  It was fun.

But he left on his own with a bare cupboard in place, even though those above him had been replaced.  It was a calculated move on his part, which is fine, but garners no sympathy from me.  The fact that people are still pining for him is embarrassing. 

[Pakuni]

I enjoyed Buzz's time here.  It was fun.

But he left on his own with a bare cupboard in place, even though those above him had been replaced.  It was a calculated move on his part, which is fine, but garners no sympathy from me.  The fact that people are still pining for him is embarrassing.

Exactly this.
The reason Buzz left is because he wanted to leave. Not because someone messed with his happy or hurt his feelings. He wanted it. And he wanted it long before Larry Williams and Scott Pilarz supposedly hurt his feels (see: flirtations with SMU, Oklahoma)
And that's fine. Doesn't make him a bad guy. But the incessant pining from some Marquette fans over a guy who couldn't wait to leave town is indeed embarrassing.

[skianth16]

I wonder if people on VTScoop are going to be making the same excuses for Buzz five years later that people here are making.  It's kind of embarrassing.

This just doesn't make any sense. What fan wouldn't want to have the same level of program we had under Buzz? It doesn't matter why or how he left. Should we take down the Wade and Final Four banners because Crean left on his own too? Are we only allowed to look back fondly on coaches that were fired?

Buzz's teams were a ton of fun to watch, and they were very successful. That era was one of the best ever for MU fans. To deny how good of a coach he was or to downplay his success here just because he chose to leave for another program doesn't change the actual history he created here. Just because Wojo is here now and Buzz is gone doesn't mean that fans should automatically think more highly of Wojo and think less of Buzz.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

This just doesn't make any sense. What fan wouldn't want to have the same level of program we had under Buzz? It doesn't matter why or how he left. Should we take down the Wade and Final Four banners because Crean left on his own too? Are we only allowed to look back fondly on coaches that were fired?

Buzz's teams were a ton of fun to watch, and they were very successful. That era was one of the best ever for MU fans. To deny how good of a coach he was or to downplay his success here just because he chose to leave for another program doesn't change the actual history he created here. Just because Wojo is here now and Buzz is gone doesn't mean that fans should automatically think more highly of Wojo and think less of Buzz.

Of course we should be happy for what was accomplished during the Buzz era.  How he left only matters because some here want to bend history to blame Marquette, when Buzz did what he wanted to do by his own accord.  I guess he accomplished what he wanted to by actually getting people to believe he was the victim in all of this.

[brewcity77]

This just doesn't make any sense. What fan wouldn't want to have the same level of program we had under Buzz?

That's not the problem. It's the odd belief that some seem to hold that by firing Wojo, we'll magically return to those halcyon days.

For me, this year proved two things. First, Wojo can absolutely recruit & develop a top-10 team. We know this because that's where we were in February. Second, Wojo has not yet developed the consistency to be considered an elite coach. We know this because of the last month.

At the end of the year, Wojo posted the 5th best regular season in the 64+ team era. The way it ended was disappointing, but the net result was still a clear positive. He's not going anywhere, & Buzz isn't coming back even if he does, so why pine for the one that left?

[MU82]

That's not the problem. It's the odd belief that some seem to hold that by firing Wojo, we'll magically return to those halcyon days.

For me, this year proved two things. First, Wojo can absolutely recruit & develop a top-10 team. We know this because that's where we were in February. Second, Wojo has not yet developed the consistency to be considered an elite coach. We know this because of the last month.

At the end of the year, Wojo posted the 5th best regular season in the 64+ team era. The way it ended was disappointing, but the net result was still a clear positive. He's not going anywhere, & Buzz isn't coming back even if he does, so why pine for the one that left?

Superbly stated, brewski.

[Nukem2]

That's not the problem. It's the odd belief that some seem to hold that by firing Wojo, we'll magically return to those halcyon days.

For me, this year proved two things. First, Wojo can absolutely recruit & develop a top-10 team. We know this because that's where we were in February. Second, Wojo has not yet developed the consistency to be considered an elite coach. We know this because of the last month.

At the end of the year, Wojo posted the 5th best regular season in the 64+ team era. The way it ended was disappointing, but the net result was still a clear positive. He's not going anywhere, & Buzz isn't coming back even if he does, so why pine for the one that left?

Yup.

[muguru]

I wanted to post this to show everyone what I wanted/hoped for under Wojo...Everyone always says "it takes time". Well, this proves it doesn't. Granted it's not at the "elite" level, like I pine for, but if Chris Beard could do this in three years, why could Wojo not?? You talk about a positive trend! If MU had this the last 3 years under Wojo, I'd be completely satisfied, and sing his praises constantly.

Texas Tech Red Raiders (Big 12 Conference) (2016–present) 
2016–17  Texas Tech  18–14 6–12 T–7th 
2017–18  Texas Tech  27–10 11–7 T–2nd NCAA Division I Elite Eight 
2018–19  Texas Tech  29–6 14–4 T–1st NCAA Division I Elite Eight 


I more wanted to say "it can be done" in the time frame I wanted to see...again, not "elite" level, but damn if this isn't impressive as hell in 3 years. Again, I will ask, why would this be unrealistic to have asked for from Wojo??

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Because Chris Beard is a better coach than Wojo.

[MU82]

I wanted to post this to show everyone what I wanted/hoped for under Wojo...Everyone always says "it takes time". Well, this proves it doesn't. Granted it's not at the "elite" level, like I pine for, but if Chris Beard could do this in three years, why could Wojo not?? You talk about a positive trend! If MU had this the last 3 years under Wojo, I'd be completely satisfied, and sing his praises constantly.

Texas Tech Red Raiders (Big 12 Conference) (2016–present) 
2016–17  Texas Tech  18–14 6–12 T–7th 
2017–18  Texas Tech  27–10 11–7 T–2nd NCAA Division I Elite Eight 
2018–19  Texas Tech  29–6 14–4 T–1st NCAA Division I Elite Eight 


I more wanted to say "it can be done" in the time frame I wanted to see...again, not "elite" level, but damn if this isn't impressive as hell in 3 years. Again, I will ask, why would this be unrealistic to have asked for from Wojo??

Of course it can happen. It has, as with Beard.

I don't know anything about TTech. I don't know if they already had all the pieces in place or if they don't care about academics or if they brought in a bunch of jucos or if Beard is simply a great recruiter and coach.

On the surface, it's darn impressive, and, sure, I wish we had as much success in Wojo's first three years as TTech has had in Beard's first three years.

Why didn't it happen under Wojo? Not sure. Also not sure why it didn't happen under Wright, under K, under Wooden, under Calhoun, under Dean Smith, under Massimino, under Sutton, under Driesell, under Olson, under Henson, under Beilein, under Calipari, under Barnes, under Thompson, etc.

Is Beard also a better coach than all of them were?

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Beard has a great deal of experience in a variety of settings.  As did Buzz.  I think it helped them both succeed.  That has been one of Wojo's negatives - he was exposed to one program when he got to MU.  That lack of diversity didn't serve him well.

[BM1090]

Beard is awesome. He's going to win wherever he goes.

He's the exception, not the rule.

[Cheeks]

I wanted to post this to show everyone what I wanted/hoped for under Wojo...Everyone always says "it takes time". Well, this proves it doesn't. Granted it's not at the "elite" level, like I pine for, but if Chris Beard could do this in three years, why could Wojo not?? You talk about a positive trend! If MU had this the last 3 years under Wojo, I'd be completely satisfied, and sing his praises constantly.

Texas Tech Red Raiders (Big 12 Conference) (2016–present) 
2016–17  Texas Tech  18–14 6–12 T–7th 
2017–18  Texas Tech  27–10 11–7 T–2nd NCAA Division I Elite Eight 
2018–19  Texas Tech  29–6 14–4 T–1st NCAA Division I Elite Eight 


I more wanted to say "it can be done" in the time frame I wanted to see...again, not "elite" level, but damn if this isn't impressive as hell in 3 years. Again, I will ask, why would this be unrealistic to have asked for from Wojo??

Tubby Smith had Tech going in a positive direction when he left...he was only there a few years including NCAA berth his last year.

2014-15  13-19   3-15 conference
2015-16  19-13   9-9 conference  NCAA

Beard took over a NCAA team on an upward trajectory.  Wojo took over a team that wasn't even in the NIT, on a downward trajectory.  Why do you continue to make these apple to oranges comparisons with Wojo?

That is not taking anything away from Beard, who has a helluva a team this year.  I was there last night, these guys are amazing on defense.  A lot of Tech fans showed up and absolutely drowned out the Meatchicken fans.  Gonzaga fans are worried, I can tell you that.