Cost of Al versus BC/Arena for NIT Games

[PaintTouches]

If it makes you feel better, no one outside of the fanbases of the two teams was watching that game.

Unrelated, but the MU/Harvard game got 369k viewers, MU's 2nd best cable game of the season, behind 400k against Wichita State. That still says more about FS1 than anything else, but a lot of people that don't normally watch Marquette were watching, and that was directly against the NCAA First Four games.

[Bocephys]

Unrelated, but the MU/Harvard game got 369k viewers, MU's 2nd best cable game of the season, behind 400k against Wichita State. That still says more about FS1 than anything else, but a lot of people that don't normally watch Marquette were watching, and that was directly against the NCAA First Four games.

Wojo's first postseason victory over an NCAA tournament team!

[Mr. Nielsen]

Yes, more people watched the NIT, than people release they do. Sunday numbers will be low going up versus CBS coverage of Syracuse/Michigan State and Tiger on NBC. Tuesday will be a nice showcase for Penn State/MU.

[79Warrior]

If it makes you feel better, no one outside of the fanbases of the two teams was watching that game.

And I don't think it left anyone with as bad an impression as you state.

Yep. What's better, 10,000 empty seats at the Bradley Center or a full Al? The NIT is not a money maker, so MU is wise to play where the rent is free.

[Benny B]

Working on getting some hard figures, but all ticket, TV, Radio and Internet revenue for the NIT gets collected by the NIT LLC. They then take a cut and distribute to each team based on games played.

The NIT LLC explicitly says it will not pay for rent of an arena, so MU would have been on the hook for it. Rent at the BC is/was 29k, plus 2$ of every ticket sold. So 3 games with 8k each would have run MU $135k ($87K directly) simply in rent. And again, the NIT gets the rest of the ticket revenue, not MU.

A 2009 article I found said a school that made it to NY would get $25-50k. I'm sure that's gone up with new TV contracts. 

All that said, I think it was a no-brainer to play (and continue playing) these games at the Al.   

AG's pretty much nailed it.... the last time I did a tourney share calculation was around the time of the C7 split, and as I recall, the NIT shares were worth about $15-19k at the time (although they are paid out in one drop, not over six years like NCAA shares).  You get 1 share for each game you play in during regionals, and you get 2 shares for making it to NY, whether you play in the championship game or not.

So beat PSU on Tuesday, and it's about $100,000 in MU's pocket.  If MU was certain it was going to get to NYC, then that would have financially justified renting the BC for the regional games... of course, hindsight is 20-20 because if you don't, then you lose money on rent.  Not sure anyone here would have taken that risk with their own money, so it makes sense that MU didn't take the risk either.

The Al was the best option for the NIT games, period.  Hopefully, we'll not be having this debate again for a very long time, if ever.

[Herman Cain]

AG's pretty much nailed it.... the last time I did a tourney share calculation was around the time of the C7 split, and as I recall, the NIT shares were worth about $15-19k at the time (although they are paid out in one drop, not over six years like NCAA shares).  You get 1 share for each game you play in during regionals, and you get 2 shares for making it to NY, whether you play in the championship game or not.

So beat PSU on Tuesday, and it's about $100,000 in MU's pocket.  If MU was certain it was going to get to NYC, then that would have financially justified renting the BC for the regional games... of course, hindsight is 20-20 because if you don't, then you lose money on rent.  Not sure anyone here would have taken that risk with their own money, so it makes sense that MU didn't take the risk either.

The Al was the best option for the NIT games, period.  Hopefully, we'll not be having this debate again for a very long time, if ever.

All in it if we make it to the Garden it is probably a break even proposition, given all the costs involved. The Benefit is we would have 4 or 5 games in front of a decent broadcast audience.

[Coleman]

AG's pretty much nailed it.... the last time I did a tourney share calculation was around the time of the C7 split, and as I recall, the NIT shares were worth about $15-19k at the time (although they are paid out in one drop, not over six years like NCAA shares).  You get 1 share for each game you play in during regionals, and you get 2 shares for making it to NY, whether you play in the championship game or not.

So beat PSU on Tuesday, and it's about $100,000 in MU's pocket.  If MU was certain it was going to get to NYC, then that would have financially justified renting the BC for the regional games... of course, hindsight is 20-20 because if you don't, then you lose money on rent.  Not sure anyone here would have taken that risk with their own money, so it makes sense that MU didn't take the risk either.

The Al was the best option for the NIT games, period.  Hopefully, we'll not be having this debate again for a very long time, if ever.

Do the shares go right to MU, or are they distributed to all members of the conference like NCAA tournament shares?

[barfolomew]

So beat PSU on Tuesday, and it's about $100,000 in MU's pocket.

That should be plenty for a top tier PG grad transfer.

[MU82]

The Al was the best option for the NIT games, period.  Hopefully, we'll not be having this debate again for a very long time, if ever.

Agree with the first sentence.

Agree x1,000,000,000 with the second sentence!

[Benny B]

Do the shares go right to MU, or are they distributed to all members of the conference like NCAA tournament shares?

One time payment, directly to the University's coffers no later than August following the tournament, IIRC.

[MUBigDance]

Well, playing in an NBA arena right near campus makes the most sense... until it doesn't financially.  To build our own, would be a bit silly, if he Bucks make it financially attractive for Marquette. 

I don't know about the details of the negotiations, but it seems they did not go too well for Marquette.  Maybe that is just because Marquette's expectations were not in line with reality or maybe the Bucks really did stick it to MU. 

I had read/heard (no inside info) that the Bucks were offering a one year deal or some sort of short term deal to begin negotiations.  Probably just a bargaining chip to give in on to "concede" some other point to Marquette.

When doesn't it make sense to play in the new arena, when the Bucks make is financially a no brainer to build your own, or don't enter into early negotiations on an extension for the current deal (7 years?)... we will need to start planning for the new arena now, and start negotiating in 4 years on the extension. If it doesn't go well at all, we will have a new arena.  Maybe the Admirals can be a tenant.

Anyone with inside info on how the negotiations really went that can share some details here?

I don't sense any loyalty on behalf of the Bucks toward Marquette basketball. Do they really care about Marquette's business? genuine question, not rhetorical. I really wonder what they think of college basketball at their place...maybe they would rather have concerts and pop-culture stuff more. I've got to believe its a bottom-line thing for the out-of-towners.

That being said...we will be there next year and it will be a nice venue.

[GOO]

One time payment, directly to the University's coffers no later than August following the tournament, IIRC.

Downpayment on the new arena, no doubt 

#startthefund

[Benny B]

Downpayment on the new arena, no doubt 

#startthefund

The fund has already been started.... just waiting on those Powerball investments to pay off and the Benny B Memorial Thunderdome will be born.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

Downpayment on the new arena, no doubt 

#startthefund

Maybe CoachTomCrean will finally deliver his hundo that he promised.

[Coleman]

One time payment, directly to the University's coffers no later than August following the tournament, IIRC.

Not that I doubt you (I don't), but does that mean that we get paid more for making the NIT than a team that makes the NCAA tournament? Because aren't tournament payments distributed to the entire conference equally?

[brewcity77]

Not that I doubt you (I don't), but does that mean that we get paid more for making the NIT than a team that makes the NCAA tournament? Because aren't tournament payments distributed to the entire conference equally?

That is at the discretion of the conference. Many conference share all revenues equally. It's worked for the Big East, though in some leagues, most notably the WCC, it has created issues because it's always Gonzaga earning shares and they are sick of sharing with other schools that contribute nothing to the coffers.

[Benny B]

Not that I doubt you (I don't), but does that mean that we get paid more for making the NIT than a team that makes the NCAA tournament? Because aren't tournament payments distributed to the entire conference equally?

NCAA tournament shares are upwards of $275,000 this year, and every game appearance earns you one share for the next six years.  So assuming a modest rate of inflation ($300,000 in year six), a single NCAA game this year translates into a little over $1.7M to the conference.

It's unclear how the Big East distributes those funds... it used to be that the schools kept half of the shares they earned and the other half went to the conference, but even if it was divided equally ten ways, if MU was a one-and-done in the NCAA this year, worse case is they would have taken home ~$170,000 over the next six years for the privilege of flaming out.

The main difference between the NIT and NCAA is that the latter is a six-year annuity whereas the NIT is a one-time payment.

[Coleman]

NCAA tournament shares are upwards of $275,000 this year, and every game appearance earns you one share for the next six years.  So assuming a modest rate of inflation ($300,000 in year six), a single NCAA game this year translates into a little over $1.7M to the conference.

It's unclear how the Big East distributes those funds... it used to be that the schools kept half of the shares they earned and the other half went to the conference, but even if it was divided equally ten ways, if MU was a one-and-done in the NCAA this year, worse case is they would have taken home ~$170,000 over the next six years for the privilege of flaming out.

The main difference between the NIT and NCAA is that the latter is a six-year annuity whereas the NIT is a one-time payment.

Right. That all makes sense. But I guess my point was...ASSUMING that the Big East distributes NCAA shares, in their entirety, to all members of the conference (I realize this is an assumption), a team making the NIT that keeeps all of their earnings would stand to make more $$ that way.

I like the idea of splitting it, the team keeping half, the conference keeping half.

[Benny B]

Right. That all makes sense. But I guess my point was...ASSUMING that the Big East distributes NCAA shares, in their entirety, to all members of the conference (I realize this is an assumption), a team making the NIT that keeeps all of their earnings would stand to make more $$ that way.

I like the idea of splitting it, the team keeping half, the conference keeping half.

A one-and-done for Marquette in the NCAA this year would still have been more than twice what they stand to make by advancing to MSG tonight.

NIT maximum: $100,000
NCAA one game: $2.7 million  (divided equally among 10 schools)

[StillAWarrior]

A one-and-done for Marquette in the NCAA this year would still have been more than twice what they stand to make by advancing to MSG tonight.

NIT maximum: $100,000
NCAA one game: $2.7 million  (divided equally among 10 schools)

You didn't account for a quarter million in popcorn profits?

[Coleman]

A one-and-done for Marquette in the NCAA this year would still have been more than twice what they stand to make by advancing to MSG tonight.

NIT maximum: $100,000
NCAA one game: $2.7 million  (divided equally among 10 schools)

Gotcha. Makes sense.

[MU82]

Do we have to share any NIT proceeds with the rest of the conference?

[Coleman]

Do we have to share any NIT proceeds with the rest of the conference?

No.

[Floorslapper]

Unrelated, but the MU/Harvard game got 369k viewers, MU's 2nd best cable game of the season, behind 400k against Wichita State. That still says more about FS1 than anything else, but a lot of people that don't normally watch Marquette were watching, and that was directly against the NCAA First Four games.

Would suspect the viewership for the MU Harvard game was greatly buoyed by Harvard fans who rarely get to see their team on national television.

[Coleman]

Would suspect the viewership for the MU Harvard game was greatly buoyed by Harvard fans who rarely get to see their team on national television.

That and being on ESPN2. Way more casual sports viewers who just turn on the Duece and watch whatever is on vs. FS1.