Warriors vs Cavaliers II

[GooooMarquette]

LeBron has totally lost his composure tonight.  Green and Curry are seriously inside his head.

[GGGG]

Agreed. The ball stopped again down the stretch. Really very poor second half by cavs.

[wadesworld]

LeBron has totally lost his composure tonight.  Green and Curry are seriously inside his head.

Iggy's been in his head since game 4 of last year.

[brandx]

LeBron has totally lost his composure tonight.  Green and Curry are seriously inside his head.

Great confrontation between Lebron and Green tonight.

[wadesworld]

Great confrontation between Lebron and Green tonight.

And then LeBron trying to stop Curry from talking to the ref. Hilarious. The irony...

[forgetful]

I'm talking about the Pistons, the Knicks, the Bulls.

Those teams were often brutally physical. 

But that was because when they wanted to hit you, they hit you really hard (what I referred to as flagrants).  The idea was make them suffer.  Literally hurt them.

Honestly, if Lebron tried the drive into the defender and push off to a guy like Laimbeer or Rodman, they wouldn't need to worry about blowing the whistle for an offensive foul, because Laimbeer or Rodman would probably of broke Lebron's nose/jaw with an elbow or punch back to the face.

The thing was though, that very very physical play was always called a foul.  I like that style.  Be as physical as you can be, but call those plays fouls. 



What I'm really commenting on is the absurd moving screens (often just pushing a guy with two hands), the offensive fouls (shoving off with the forearm), and off the ball fouls (e.g. grabbing, holding, pushing a cutter) in todays game. 

[rocket surgeon]

"What I'm really commenting on is the absurd moving screens (often just pushing a guy with two hands), the offensive fouls (shoving off with the forearm), and off the ball fouls (e.g. grabbing, holding, pushing a cutter) in todays game. "



so now, good defense is grabbing the opposing player, spinning him around and preenting him from getting the ball. 
good blocking out is timing your shove of opposing player from under basket, off the floor as the ball is coming in from a shot

act like you are trying to avoid stepping on opposing player by stepping over him multiple times

players take 3 steps every time they receive the ball up top before they put it down to dribble

even mike breen commented on the change of calls during playoff games from regular season-it's like how much can i get away with?

[GGGG]

Then.  Stop.  Watching.

Seriously I don't get you people who don't watch the NBA...watch during the playoffs...and then do nothing but BITCH about the refereeing.  And then bring up 20 year old conspiracy theories blah blah blah...

If it bothers you so much, go knit a doily.  Read a book.  Take a walk. 

[JWags85]

Keys from the game last night:
-Iggy's defense.  It is absolutely incredible, breathtaking to watch at times.
-Lue played Lebron and Kyrie the whole second half.  Kyrie was GASSED at the end of the game and it showed.  Rookie coaching errors
-Lebron is rightly praised for his unselfishness, but there were 2-3 stretches in the game last night where it was right for him to try to take over and he was deferential.  Would drive straight into the GS defense and kick it back out for a reset.  Or let Kyrie take the reins, it was odd to say the least.  Almost like he senses the inevitable.

[GGGG]

The Cavs offense at the end reverted back to the "spread the floor and go one-on-one" crap that hasn't worked for them all series.  I don't know if they do that because they are gassed, or because they actually think that's going to work despite the fact that it really hasn't.

[rocket surgeon]

Then.  Stop.  Watching.

Seriously I don't get you people who don't watch the NBA...watch during the playoffs...and then do nothing but BITCH about the refereeing.  And then bring up 20 year old conspiracy theories blah blah blah...

If it bothers you so much, go knit a doily.  Read a book.  Take a walk.

my my my, you're a touchy son uv a gun.  can't a guy express what he sees or how he sees it?  you may disagree, but don't tell me it's not happening like you do with others and their sharing an experience or observation.  i just find it kind of incredulous, but very entertaining if you don't mind.  or is everything sposed to be sunshines way.  i've been watching the NBA for damn near 50 years and find it's evolution as with the college and high school games quite amazing.  if you want to disagree, then disagree.  what i don't understand is why you take it so personal...ride the bus man

[rocket surgeon]

the cavs were so out of confidence with their 3 point shooting, they tried to trade baskets at the end=fail.  when they were still in it with 2-3 min. left and tried driving the lane, GS was too quick, quick hands, etc.  you don't have to be a big man anymore to block shots

  was that a little better S of S?

[GGGG]

my my my, you're a touchy son uv a gun.  can't a guy express what he sees or how he sees it?  you may disagree, but don't tell me it's not happening like you do with others and their sharing an experience or observation.  i just find it kind of incredulous, but very entertaining if you don't mind.  or is everything sposed to be sunshines way.  i've been watching the NBA for damn near 50 years and find it's evolution as with the college and high school games quite amazing.  if you want to disagree, then disagree.  what i don't understand is why you take it so personal...ride the bus man

Reading your observations leads me to believe you haven't watched the NBA much over the past 50 years.

[rocket surgeon]

Reading your observations leads me to believe you haven't watched the NBA much over the past 50 years.

well, i'd tell you my dad split season tix with the local pharmacist in town back in the late 60's to early 70's.  i was 10 years old.  it was during the bucks inaugural years through their championship year and a few years beyond.  6th row seats right off the north basket, right next to the aisle the bucks entered.  they were $12 per seat/game.  you could pat kareem on the head if ya wanted.  but then you'd just say NO and that i was lying anyway.  so what's the use.

   i have been to many many games and watched countless on tv.  if someone would've asked me or there was a board to respond to over those years, i'd say the same thing.  just sayin that i'm incredulous at the evolution of the game.  is that allowed? or do we all just have to bow to S of S?

[forgetful]

my my my, you're a touchy son uv a gun.  can't a guy express what he sees or how he sees it?  you may disagree, but don't tell me it's not happening like you do with others and their sharing an experience or observation.  i just find it kind of incredulous, but very entertaining if you don't mind.  or is everything sposed to be sunshines way.  i've been watching the NBA for damn near 50 years and find it's evolution as with the college and high school games quite amazing.  if you want to disagree, then disagree.  what i don't understand is why you take it so personal...ride the bus man

Rocket, we are on the same page.  I haven't been on the earth long enough to watch the NBA for 50 years, but watched it religiously for about 25.  Then over the last 10, I just cannot get myself to watch a lot of the regular season (too many games, players don't take them as seriously).

Many I know that have watcher religiously over the same time agree with our observations.  Many of my friends have said they don't care; they watch it for entertainment, not the quality of basketball (in reference to rules).

[forgetful]

The Cavs offense at the end reverted back to the "spread the floor and go one-on-one" crap that hasn't worked for them all series.  I don't know if they do that because they are gassed, or because they actually think that's going to work despite the fact that it really hasn't.

If you watched when it switched; it was when Lebron went back to dominating the ball.  Needing to bring it up and dribbling for 15 seconds before doing anything.

Earlier in the game, Kyrie (who has been the best player on the floor the last two games), controlled the ball much more.  The game is more fluid with the ball in the hands of a PG.

[GGGG]

If you watched when it switched; it was when Lebron went back to dominating the ball.  Needing to bring it up and dribbling for 15 seconds before doing anything.

Earlier in the game, Kyrie (who has been the best player on the floor the last two games), controlled the ball much more.  The game is more fluid with the ball in the hands of a PG.

Irving had the ball plenty and sucked in the fourth quarter.  During an 8 minute stretch when it was a tie game to when they went down 10, he went 2/8.  Lebron wasn't much better at 1/3. 

11:33      Kevin Love makes 8-foot two point shot (Kyrie Irving assists)   79 - 79   
11:02      LeBron James makes driving layup   79 - 81   
10:22      Kyrie Irving misses driving layup   81 - 81   
10:21      LeBron James makes dunk   81 - 83   
9:41      Andre Iguodala blocks LeBron James 's 3-foot jumper   84 - 83   
9:11      LeBron James misses 25-foot three point jumper   84 - 83   
8:12      Kyrie Irving misses 5-foot jumper   88 - 83   
7:30      Kyrie Irving makes free throw 1 of 2   88 - 84   
7:30      Kyrie Irving misses free throw 2 of 2   88 - 84   
7:05      Kyrie Irving misses 26-foot three point jumper   88 - 84   
6:41      Kevin Love misses 26-foot three point jumper   90 - 84   
6:13      Kyrie Irving misses 3-foot jumper   90 - 84   
5:13      Klay Thompson blocks Kyrie Irving's layup   93 - 84   
4:43      LeBron James misses 25-foot three point jumper   93 - 84   
3:44      Kyrie Irving makes driving layup   93 - 86   
3:02      Kyrie Irving misses three point jumper   96 - 86   
2:26      Kyrie Irving misses driving layup   96 - 86   
2:08      Kyrie Irving makes two point shot (LeBron James assists)   96 - 88   
1:12      LeBron James makes free throw 1 of 2   96 - 89   
1:12      LeBron James misses free throw 2 of 2   96 - 89   
0:45      LeBron James makes driving layup   98 - 91   
0:31      Kyrie Irving makes driving layup   100 - 93   
0:23      LeBron James makes driving layup   102 - 95   
0:14      LeBron James makes driving dunk   104 - 97   


Irving:  3/9; 2/2 FT
James:  4/7 (2/5 outside of garbage time); 1/2 FT
Love: 1/2

Yeah but it's all Lebron's fault.

[brandx]

Earlier in the game, Kyrie (who has been the best player on the floor the last two games), controlled the ball much more.  The game is more fluid with the ball in the hands of a PG.

Not even close. No one who only plays 50% of the game is ever the best player on the floor.

[rocket surgeon]

Rocket, we are on the same page.  I haven't been on the earth long enough to watch the NBA for 50 years, but watched it religiously for about 25.  Then over the last 10, I just cannot get myself to watch a lot of the regular season (too many games, players don't take them as seriously).

Many I know that have watcher religiously over the same time agree with our observations.  Many of my friends have said they don't care; they watch it for entertainment, not the quality of basketball (in reference to rules).

i'll admit, my interest waned some over the last 5-10 years or so, since the bucks have really really struggled.  however,  i have watched enough to know what i am seeing.  there is a big difference between the regular season and playoffs re:how the game is called.  a couple of reasons i have begone to watch a little more than usual-1) i love watching golden state play and 2) a few hours to fill the vacuum left by my once avid interest in our, ummm...domestic affairs shall we say. 

i'll tell ya though, college basketball ain't far behind.  i'm not sure the refs know themselves what kind of standards to set re: the amount of physicality to allow.  it changes drastically however, not just  between teams of refs, but also within games themselves from 1st half to 2nd and then sometimes again in the waning minutes.  do we blow the whistle in the last few seconds?  or do we let it play out and not play a role in deciding thegame?  the good teams are well aware of this and really push the refs to the limit; to call or not to call.  who wants to put the dude on the line with no time remaining and a chance to win the game...against kentucky or duke heYn'a?

careful there forgetful, i said DAMN NEAR 50 years, just remember that...maybe closer to 48 or 49 cheezus that sounds like what my gramps used to say

[rocket surgeon]

did anyone else catch this little anecdote friday night from jeff van gundy during the cavs-warriors game?  he said that al cowlings told pat riley, a friend of his, that the reason he was driving so slowly in the infamous bronco chase was that oj wanted to hear the end of the knicks-rockets game 5 finals game(1994) as opposed to oj threatening to kill himself.  and all this while i was thinking they were really doing some 5-0 for nicole's real killer

http://www.foxnews.com/sports/2016/06/11/nba-commentator-tells-wild-story-about-oj-simpson-slow-speed-police-chase.html?intcmp=trending

[GGGG]

Not even close. No one who only plays 50% of the game is ever the best player on the floor.

And furthermore, Lebron was clearly better in game 3.  forgetful is delusional.

[forgetful]

And furthermore, Lebron was clearly better in game 3.  forgetful is delusional.

Game 3 was over in the first period when Kyrie went off for 16 points.  He payed 37 minutes to James 40.

21 of Lebrons points came in garbage time when the game was already over.  He only scored 11 in the first half. 

In Game 4 Irving and Curry were by far the best two players not the floor.  No one else was even remotely close.  I give Irving the nod, because so many of Curry's stats (points) come in garbage time from the FT line.  Irving played 43 minutes.

Irving is often guarding Curry, and doing a hell of a job.  Lebron is playing "help" defense.  The announcers even called him out for not switching onto Green, and instead making the smaller Irving guard him. 

What game were your watching where Irving only played 50% of the game.

[forgetful]

Irving had the ball plenty and sucked in the fourth quarter.  During an 8 minute stretch when it was a tie game to when they went down 10, he went 2/8.  Lebron wasn't much better at 1/3. 

11:33      Kevin Love makes 8-foot two point shot (Kyrie Irving assists)   79 - 79   
11:02      LeBron James makes driving layup   79 - 81   
10:22      Kyrie Irving misses driving layup   81 - 81   
10:21      LeBron James makes dunk   81 - 83   
9:41      Andre Iguodala blocks LeBron James 's 3-foot jumper   84 - 83   
9:11      LeBron James misses 25-foot three point jumper   84 - 83   
8:12      Kyrie Irving misses 5-foot jumper   88 - 83   
7:30      Kyrie Irving makes free throw 1 of 2   88 - 84   
7:30      Kyrie Irving misses free throw 2 of 2   88 - 84   
7:05      Kyrie Irving misses 26-foot three point jumper   88 - 84   
6:41      Kevin Love misses 26-foot three point jumper   90 - 84   
6:13      Kyrie Irving misses 3-foot jumper   90 - 84   
5:13      Klay Thompson blocks Kyrie Irving's layup   93 - 84   
4:43      LeBron James misses 25-foot three point jumper   93 - 84   
3:44      Kyrie Irving makes driving layup   93 - 86   
3:02      Kyrie Irving misses three point jumper   96 - 86   
2:26      Kyrie Irving misses driving layup   96 - 86   
2:08      Kyrie Irving makes two point shot (LeBron James assists)   96 - 88   
1:12      LeBron James makes free throw 1 of 2   96 - 89   
1:12      LeBron James misses free throw 2 of 2   96 - 89   
0:45      LeBron James makes driving layup   98 - 91   
0:31      Kyrie Irving makes driving layup   100 - 93   
0:23      LeBron James makes driving layup   102 - 95   
0:14      LeBron James makes driving dunk   104 - 97   


Irving:  3/9; 2/2 FT
James:  4/7 (2/5 outside of garbage time); 1/2 FT
Love: 1/2

Yeah but it's all Lebron's fault.

There is a difference between taking shots and dominating the ball. 

My point is Lebron started to insist on bringing the ball up.  When he does that, it is pure isolation play.  They do not get into an offense.  Everything stagnates.  (which is what you said was the problem).

The PG (Irving) needs to bring the ball up.  When he does, they get into the offense and the game flows better.

Also, Irving is young and arrogant.  When Lebron starts to try to dominate the ball, and things aren't working, all of them get into 1 on 1 mode of, I'm not going to share the ball because I'll never get it back.

Lebron is the star veteran.  Slightly unfair, but he needs to lead and be the role model.  He bears more responsibility.

[GGGG]

I think it's official forgetful.

You have a thing against Lebron and it is completely clouding your logic.

I'm done.

[forgetful]

I think it's official forgetful.

You have a thing against Lebron and it is completely clouding your logic.

I'm done.

Can you provide some logic to justify Lebron being better in game 3 and 4; and/or logic to justify Lebron bring the ball up not stagnating the offense, beside Lebron is the greatest and you not believing it.

I provided some logic. 

I also admit bias against Lebron, you have not admitted a bias towards him not ever having fault.