Coach K weighs in on Transfers.....no exceptions

[ChicosBailBonds]

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/9680502/stop-allowing-college-basketball-transfer-waivers

[GGGG]

And he also said this...

"Giving certain kids the right to play and others not the right to play, it should be done the same," he said. "If they want to let everybody play right away, then let everybody play right away. Everybody should be treated the same. I don't understand why there are exceptions to this rule."

[Nukem2]

I agree with K.  Eliminates all kinds of shenanigans.  Also, guys who transfer to be close to sick family should focus on said family for that first year....

[ChicosBailBonds]

And he also said this...

"Giving certain kids the right to play and others not the right to play, it should be done the same," he said. "If they want to let everybody play right away, then let everybody play right away. Everybody should be treated the same. I don't understand why there are exceptions to this rule."

Correct....I think that's what I said....no exceptions.  Treat everyone the same.

[CTWarrior]

Makes sense to me.  If there are people who really want or need to be near family, sitting out a year shouldn't be that big of a deterrent.  The guy who graduates with eligibility remaining and can then go to another school only if they have a graduate course that the original school doesn't offer is also ridiculous, since pretty much every school can come up with a graduate program not offered by the school that is being departed.

[IrwinFletcher]

The NCAA gets ripped on by, well, everybody because of the stupid rules they have when it comes to recruiting and everything else, but this is what they have to deal with everyday.

They institute a rule to help kids out.  They go to school a 1000 miles away and Mom is fighting cancer.  They want to transfer to be by her and family  but feel they will be hurt by having to sit out a year.  The NCAA makes an exception for these kids, showing compassion and that they are truly trying to do what is best for the kids.

What happens?  Everyone takes advantage of it and ultimately could wind up that this rule gets rescinded.

So the next time someone gets in trouble for giving a kid a free bagel, you can better understand why the NCAA has to have a zero tolerance policy on this kind of stuff.

[bilsu]

I do not think players should be allowed to follow coaches. The only thing worse than Buzz going to Texas would be any of the current players or incoming signed recruits following him. Being able to bring players along is an incentive for another team to hire your coach. I suspect Buckles was denied, because he was following his coach and if that is the reason he was denied, I agree with that decision.

[chapman]

The guy who graduates with eligibility remaining and can then go to another school only if they have a graduate course that the original school doesn't offer is also ridiculous, since pretty much every school can come up with a graduate program not offered by the school that is being departed.

Agree, the "program not offered" caveat is stupid.  I don't mind the immediate eligibility to those who graduated undergrad since it's an academic reward in a sense.  But it also punishes schools who often give a player that extra year that gets them across the finish line at no return, either from a redshirt or taking them in as a transfer and using a scholarship when they sit out only to see them graduate and leave again.

[GGGG]

You guys think way too much about the schools and not nearly enough about the students.

One free transfer for no reason whatsoever.

[Nukem2]

You guys think way too much about the schools and not nearly enough about the students.

One free transfer for no reason whatsoever.

Sounds nice, but it is a two way street.  Coach K is right.  Yawanta move, ya sit a year period.  When ya sign that NLI, it's a contract between 2 parties.  Honor that contract.  Now, if the coach leaves or the school has other issues, well....

[Jay Bee]

Rodney Hood sitting on that bench last year.......ooohweeee... look out for him this year.

[MU82]

I absolutely agree that there should be a hard, fast, no-exception rule on this issue ... as soon as there is a hard, fast, no-exception rule that a coach can't walk out on his contract at one school and start working at another immediately.

It's easy for Mr. High & Mighty to want a rule constraining 20-year-olds that he doesn't have to abide by himself.

He can leave for untold millions but if a kid leave wants to leave for an opportunity ... screw the "student/athlete."

What a hypocritical crock of you-know-what.

[Dawson Rental]

Makes sense to me.  If there are people who really want or need to be near family, sitting out a year shouldn't be that big of a deterrent.  The guy who graduates with eligibility remaining and can then go to another school only if they have a graduate course that the original school doesn't offer is also ridiculous, since pretty much every school can come up with a graduate program not offered by the school that is being departed.

But, the student must also want to work toward a graduate degree in "whatever" graduate program the school he's transferring to has "come up with", and the program must be able to be taken by someone who has heavy demands on his time already for basketball.  Oh, and to graduate in grad school you need a B average.

[bilsu]

I absolutely agree that there should be a hard, fast, no-exception rule on this issue ... as soon as there is a hard, fast, no-exception rule that a coach can't walk out on his contract at one school and start working at another immediately.

It's easy for Mr. High & Mighty to want a rule constraining 20-year-olds that he doesn't have to abide by himself.

He can leave for untold millions but if a kid leave wants to leave for an opportunity ... screw the "student/athlete."

What a hypocritical crock of you-know-what.

Most, if not all, coaching contacts contain buyout agreements. Also, if you are going to hold coaches to the contracts than schools should not be allowed to fire them before the end of the contract.

[ChicosBailBonds]

You guys think way too much about the schools and not nearly enough about the students.

One free transfer for no reason whatsoever.

Thinking plenty about the students...they are free to transfer where they wish in my mind.  I wouldn't allow anyone to block a transfer, but yes they still have to sit out a year.  Otherwise it would not only hurt the schools, but also the game and the students. 

Most of these guys went to a school to play basketball or some other sport and usually leave because of lack of playing time or something like that.  A "free pass", which is almost exactly what you describe is just that, a free no consequences pass.  That's not how the real world is.....before someone says any kid can transfer to another school, that's true but they aren't in a full ride scholarship either to play a sport so it's not an apples to apples comparison.

[GGGG]

Sounds nice, but it is a two way street.  Coach K is right.  Yawanta move, ya sit a year period.  When ya sign that NLI, it's a contract between 2 parties.  Honor that contract.  Now, if the coach leaves or the school has other issues, well....

The NLI is completely irrelevant to this discussion.

[GGGG]

......

[ChicosBailBonds]

The NLI is completely irrelevant to this discussion.

Why?

[Benny B]

Thinking plenty about the students...they are free to transfer where they wish in my mind.  I wouldn't allow anyone to block a transfer, but yes they still have to sit out a year.  Otherwise it would not only hurt the schools, but also the game and the students. 

Most of these guys went to a school to play basketball or some other sport and usually leave because of lack of playing time or something like that.  A "free pass", which is almost exactly what you describe is just that, a free no consequences pass.  That's not how the real world is.....before someone says any kid can transfer to another school, that's true but they aren't in a full ride scholarship either to play a sport so it's not an apples to apples comparison.

If this were the case 100% of the time, I would be a wholesale advocate of no free transfers.  The message should be "if you want to play hard, you need to work hard."  That's real life.  And that's Marquette basketball (which is why I'm obviously biased as I continue my thought...)

High-major D-I coaches don't recruit guys to ride the bench... they recruit guys with who have the potential to get minutes for their team.  Saban doesn't recruit kids whose ceiling is being a starter at Akron; every guy he recruits has the talent to tryst with the Tuscaloosa turf.

Closer to home, Buzz Williams didn't recruit Davante thinking "hey, I have a scholarship left... maybe I'll give it to a middling three-star just for the heck of it."  No, Buzz took Davante knowing that if the kid works his tail off, someday he's going to be a leader on this team.  Buzz has recruited several kids with more potential than Davante who never amounted to anything.  He's recruited kids with less talent than most five-stars and turned them into NBA players.

In other words, if a kid signs an NLI to a school, 99% of the time, he has the potential to be in the regular rotation; it's entirely up to the kid as to whether he develops the ability to be a regular.  Therefore, no free transfers unless there are extenuating circumstances.  The problem here isn't the transfer rules, the players, the coaches or even the schools.... the problem is that the NCAA can't pull their head out of their ass to enforce the rules equitably.

[Jay Bee]

Why?

"Completely irrelevant" might be pushing it, but it's not of any real significance. Voluntary contract that is entered in by only some players prior to initial enrollment. y a w n

[GGGG]

"Completely irrelevant" might be pushing it, but it's not of any real significance. Voluntary contract that is entered in by only some players prior to initial enrollment. y a w n

Yes.  Thank you.

[MU82]

Most, if not all, coaching contacts contain buyout agreements. Also, if you are going to hold coaches to the contracts than schools should not be allowed to fire them before the end of the contract.

If a school fires a coach under contract, he still gets paid every penny he has coming to him. That coach can even become a head coach or assistant at another school or in the NBA and get paid by two organizations.

But if a coach fires a student-athlete, the kid is completely on his own.

Please ... let's not even try to claim that coaches have the right to high moral ground on this issue. They own the kids. Aside from the true superstars, the kids are totally beholden to every whim by the coaches, who are free to do what they want in their careers with almost total freedom.

[Jay Bee]

If a school fires a coach under contract, he still gets paid every penny he has coming to him. That coach can even become a head coach or assistant at another school or in the NBA and get paid by two organizations.

That is completely false. It depends on the contract and it varies substantially from contract to contract. Tom Crean has a HUGE buyout if Indiana cans him, but most coaches do not.

Also, many (i.e., Ben Howland as an example - that's why he's not working right now) termination provisions include an offset if future employment is obtained.

You're completely off on this.

[CTWarrior]

You guys think way too much about the schools and not nearly enough about the students.

One free transfer for no reason whatsoever.

I actually agree with you.  But I really think what Coach K says is right.  Either everybody has to sit out a year or nobody does.  I could even see a rule that specifies that you must sit out a year unless you graduated, in which case you can transfer anywhere and play immediately.  But a clear rule without case by case exceptions makes the most sense.

[TJ]

Sounds nice, but it is a two way street.  Coach K is right.  Yawanta move, ya sit a year period.  When ya sign that NLI, it's a contract between 2 parties.  Honor that contract.  Now, if the coach leaves or the school has other issues, well....

"well...." - what does that mean?  Does the school/coach have to honor their part of the contract or not?  What exactly is the school's part of the contract?

If I were a top recruit, no way in hell would I ever sign an NLI.  Very one-sided contract - totally binding to the player with very little obligation on the school/coach side.